Why, if you live in France, did you vote for Brexit?

You have had my reply Simon and my reasons for it. Maybe you would like to reply to my two questions?No, I didn’t think so.

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Oh dear Poppy - you sound like someone used to getting their own way. I surrender and will happily answer your 2 questions:

Because the Daily Mail is very popular among Brexiters and actively supported and influenced the leave campaign.

Absolutely no idea - I haven’t asked them.

Do you read it Poppy?

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Do they have the Daily Mail up in heaven? (well I assume that’s where Tony is now)

Oooh I can name-drop here :grin: :grin: - I had breakfast with Tony Benn once. Well not just the two of us, you understand… but sitting at the same table.
Have to admit, I didn’t see him reading the DM, nor any other rag either, so can’t help with the argument.

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Couldn’t vote even though the tories promised I could.

The referendum was advisory but parliament never got to debate the outcome.

The only way to kill off UKIP is to accept the voice of the people, it’s as political as it gets, and the tory party are taking a huge gamble.

The UK has a privileged membership in the EU, not with the Euro, not in Shengen etc…

No obvious benefits to leave, no £350M for the NHS etc…

Campaigns built on lies, we know, but still respect the result we are told.

We have big problems at home, public sector pay, NHS, etc… no money for that but OK to buy DUP support for £1bn and possibly a £60bn+ brexit bill, are these really the priorities for the UK right now?

I’m really not convinced that this is in the best interests of anybody in the UK.

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Patrick, thank you for taking the time to answer. I am afraid I must take issue with your specific example. You yourself describe the regulation that affects you as being the result of lobbying by French boat builders, I am sure you are right about this. Here’s the rub- years of disinformation by right wingers have somehow engrained the idea that ALL irksome regulation comes from Brussels, this is demonstrably untrue. In my own field (construction) there are no European rules I regularly need to deal with, none whatsoever. Building regs in the UK are entirely home grown. French rules about not modifying your car are entirely French. Whilst your example is, I am sure, EU sourced, I would contend that it would probably have come about as a French law if the EU did not exist. Remove the UK or FRANCE from the EU and you will have the same annoying rules, indeed the U.K. Govt has already drafted a bill to pass all EU sourced regs into U.K. Law as part of Brexit preparations. Most people vastly overestimate the number of regulations that come from Brussels. Most of what EU rules try to do are about consumer protection and establishing a level playing field for those of us who work and trade in Europe. Your understandable vexation is in my opinion mis-directed.

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Hi Robert,
To be honest my argument with the EU has little to do with any specific regulations which emanate from Brussels, but a lot more to do with the unacceptable and ultimately unworkable structure of the governing institutions. I only responded with my particular regulatory niggle because I was provoked into giving an example.

The real problem, as I have already mentioned in an earlier post on this topic, is that the power to initiate, amend and repeal legislation is not in the hands of the elected representatives of the people, but in those of a relatively few, mostly appointed rather than directly elected, virtually unsackable bureaucrats who, together with their staff and advisors are clearly open to being influenced (to put it kindly) by a vast and powerful lobbying industry in Brussels.

To make matters worse some heads of state and ministers of some member states’ governments seem to have the power to make up policy on the hoof, with little or no open, transparent, democratic discussion and then to impose it on other unwilling or less influential states.

The government of a European Union should not be allowed to be carried on in closed rooms, late at night, by a few people who try, often very successfully, to use bullying tactics on weaker members or those with fewer allies. It is the structure of Brussels that needs changing and democratising, so that everyone can see that the executive branch is fully accountable to a directly elected legislature. If this structure is not reformed there will be trouble, and probably very damaging revolt further down the line.

That is my real problem with the EU, not silly matters of minor legislation even if they are the result of lobbying by powerful industrial or financial interests, and even when they directly affect me.

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When did you stand for MEP ? If you don’t like it change it.
Or do you want to reimpose on your grandchildren the horror of guessing where the missile will land?

Now I’m really confused! Just seen on the news that the UK government proposed a bill that will transfer EU laws to British legislation. But isn’t that exactly what brexiteers are complaining about - EU laws becoming UK ones???
Perhaps brexiteers will make up their bloody minds!

@anon90504988 I know how you feel… my brain is suffering overload… and now this…

but I’m sure it says somewhere… that any EU laws or legislation that UK doesn’t want to keep… can be discarded later on… or did I dream that :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

will we wake up and find this was all a bad dream (shades of Dallas :wink:)

It’s to allow legislation to change at whatever pace is necessary. If the UK just left the EU and all its controls it would fall into chaos. (imagine that!) Now all the EU laws are British laws the day after Brexit will be just like any other day, then they can start cutting those nasty laws about workers’ rights etc as and when they want without everything else falling apart. A few years down the line it will be interesting to see what is left and what was cut just for the hell of it.

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You’ll find them all here:

Apparently it concerns 12,000 of them - how long have you got?

And then TM wonders why the EU is unhappy at the prospect of their citizens being dealt with by UK law and having no recourse to the ECJ after Brexit.

This is why the rich with off-shore havens manipulated the media, etc…to cause brexit. http://europa.eu/rapid/press-release_IP-17-1433_en.htm

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Karen, it is important that one does some research and gets facts correct (inasmuch as one can get ‘correct’ facts from the internet), before stating things like ‘London it is France’s second city’ … here are the figures from INSEE to show France’s major towns in terms of size … https://lespoir.jimdo.com/2015/03/05/classement-des-plus-grandes-villes-de-france-source-insee/
It is impossible to know how many French people are in London.

Simon, do you have any figures for French people living in London? I’d be very interested to know if you have … Thanks in advance! Cordially Claire

Very well said Peter.

Claire just have a quick Google - lot’s of BBC source stats :wink:

Or if you prefer: https://www.google.fr/amp/www.standard.co.uk/news/london/emmanuel-macron-london-to-be-the-sixth-biggest-french-city-a3473126.html%3Famp

And no, I haven’t actually counted them myself… :slight_smile:

I don’t live in France but in another EU country. I am a Brit and I voted remain for two reasons.

  1. I sincerely believe that although flawed the EU is a fundamentaly a good idea and Britain benefits from being a member and leaving would damage Britain.
  2. Freedom of movement. As a Brit living permanently outside of Britain the loss of FOM would damage me and my family.

13 months later I clearly see that 1) is coming to pass and it may be worse than I feared.
2) Is being addressed but with both sides still a long way apart.

Hopefully when Barnier and Davis stand up in Brussels on Thursday at 14.00 for the press conference we will hear good news about Citizens rights.

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Germany and France currently have no problem trading with China and India. What is the precise difficulty that Britain has? Serious question.

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