Aladdin cancelled

Badger, I hadn’t realised you’re a luvvy!!!

In French stage left is ‘côté cour’, and stage right is ‘côté jardin’ because of the theatre in the Tuileries.

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Nice idea, but it’ll probably take the best part of a lifetime…

The acquisition of haptic knowledge - and ultimately mastery - is a much slower affair than doing a f/t PhD

But, I don’t think you’d be happy with anything less.

Hope you have long lived ancestors!

Well you had me there Mark, had to look up haptic.

the use of technology that stimulates the senses of touch and motion, especially to reproduce in remote operation or computer simulation the sensations that would be felt by a user interacting directly with physical objects.

“their research is centred on human-computer interaction specifically focusing on wearable computing, haptics, and video games”

the perception of objects by touch and proprioception, especially as involved in non-verbal communication.

“haptics is that subsystem of non-language communication which conveys meaning through physical contact”

Yes, it does take a lifetime to learn carpentry skills and you never stop learning, and improving, but according to the above explanation not sure haptic comes into it. Before throw away saws became the norm we had to learn to sharpen our handsaws or send them to a saw doctor but dont think he had a PhD :wink:

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I’d have to disagree with that and…there are studies to suggest that this can be transferred generationally too.

I’m not sure what you’re disagreeing with, the guild based apprentice system that prevailed in mediaeval Europe and continues to this day in many countries and contexts was based on the generational relay of skills from father to son (and occasionally daughter -eg Artemesia Gentileschi).

Similarly, I refered to haptic knowledge principally in the context of acquiring the sort of manual skills associated with a highly skilled artisan or craftsperson. However, I could add that having lectured in fine art printmaking (screenprinting, etching, lithography and relief printing) for twenty years or so, I had a technical skill set that used to be combined with aesthetic advice, which is a related, yet wholly different category.

Sorry, but I don’t think your online definition has served you well.

In the context of craft, particularly, haptic knowledge or understandings are what we might just describe as a craftsperson’s skills - they exist in the interplay between the skilled hand and the practitioner’s experienced understanding of materials and process. Nothing more.

And nothing to to do with PhDs, unless someone is researching haptic skills.

This.

Perhaps it is best to think about haptic skills in a more present day context? For instance, learning to hover in a helicopter ?

Kind of, but not one that “treads the boards”.

40 years in theatre, entertainment, event & concert lighting, electrics & production. I still keep my hand in at a major festival.

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A thought provoking question deserves a serious, if incomplete response!

France probably still has more traditional artisanal craftspeople than helicopter pilots ! I tried unsuccessfully to find a number for the latter, but couldn’t. However I’ve calculated that there are at least four times as many artisans currently working on the restoration of Notre Dame as there are helicopter pilots in the entire Sécurité Civile helicopter group. I also know there’s a massive shortage in the former sector.

I know nothing about flying helicopters, so can’t answer whether it should be considered a haptic skill, but the term is usually specifically applied to making processes where there is a large degree of intuitive decision making with regard to the hand working the material, for instance throwing a pot on a wheel. ie situations where the hand rather than the brain seems to be doing the thinking.

I was amazed by Richarlison’s amazingly instantly improvised second goal for Brazil against Serbia the other night,* one might describe it as ‘haptic’ because it was so highly skilled and instantly intuitive, but for me that wouldn’t really add anything useful to the definition.

  • I wanted to post a link, but FIFA has had the video blocked on copyright grounds

Cant see the pundits describing a goal as haptic!
More like ‘it was ever so good’.
What is it about football speak that makes me cringe?
Best bit about this world cup is that it is causing mininal disruption to normal tv, and there is always Netflix or prime as a back up.

Despite professional football’s many faults it remains the case that on the pitch live football is unpredictable, real time drama, real life drama and as such very different to the synthetic stuff manufactured by Disney and their ilk.

I watch on TF1 in French so it’s unlikely I’ll encounter ‘haptic’, or even haptique.

However, my pet English football commentator’s hate is ‘sublime’ it’s usage is a complete degredation of the aesthetic term’s actual meaning - it does not and never did mean ‘very good’.

Sorry, but when Greavesie scored a goal or Hoddle passed a ball it was ‘sublime’ .

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Sublime might also be another word for lemon. :wink:

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Sorry Peter, but it wasn’t - you need to find out what the word actually means. Denis Law was my Greavesie equivalent and I’d never dream of describing any of his goals as ‘sublime’.

If price differential is anything to go by, I’d certainly agree with you, but on the other hand can something that is a ‘lemon’ ever be sublime?

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And England’s performance yesterday was ?
Perhaps akin to a Disney production, a very bad one.

Wouldn’t disagree, but I’m suporting Les bleus

Beauty is in the eye of the beer holder, or so I’m told. :smile:

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So would a ‘beer holder’ be the glass or the beer drinker? It must be obvious from my question that I know little about either.