Thanks Jane. Good to know.
The important thing for the visitors is that they can prove where they will be staying for the duration of their stay. So if they’re staying in a gite or any other form of commercial holiday accommodation than any booking reservation documents should suffice. If they are staying in someone’s home this needs to have been officially approved with this attestation which as far as I understand, came into force on May 1st.
But, as Paul pointed out earlier, it’s not totally clear as those who haven’ t booked or planned accommodation are able to show that they have 120 euros per day resources.
Although chances are it probably won’t be checked that much, I still wouldn’t want to be without it as if asked and you don’t have it, border officials can just send you back. Living in the north this puts paid to Kent relatives ‘popping over’ on a whim at the last minute, unless they’re willing to pay for accommodation.
Sadly another thing that just highlights exactly what the loss of ‘freedom of movement’ means in practice.
I don’t think it has just come into existence - I remember reading about it for non-EU visitors years ago.
How in heaven’s name will a border guard be able to tell between a mocked up reservation form from a hotel/gîte and the real thing? Are they really going to phone the hotel to check reservation is real?
I remember going to Algeria we had to jump through many hoops with accommodation papers, and they were checked line by line. But I can’t see that happening at the eurostar or ferry terminal.
Absolutely. As I said above. My friends with S.African passports were planning to visit in 2012 and the form had already been around for quite a while.
Yes - I mentioned it a few days ago in one of the brexit threads - it’s simply another unfortunate automatic consequence of brexit.
Along with many - more bleating in the Torygraph today about the fact that it’s now much harder for Britons to move & retire to the EU.
For those of us that understood what the loss of FoM meant this is genuinely sad - at least France does not have unachievable minimum income requirements.
For the rest, those that voted Leave and now either cannot have their retirement dream or are having to repatriate to the UK - tough. They knew as we are told ad nauseam that they knew what they were voting for. Maybe, but it seems they are only now finding out what it *meant*.
Apologies for having raised a similar thread this morning…now justifiably closed…I did search, honest!
Seems that the implications of the requirement to get a visitor attestation is only becoming widely understood as travel restrictions are relaxed.
Whether it becomes a significant issue politically remains to be seen with pressure for a change, and if it does no guarantee it will happen quickly if at all.
Many Brits, and I suspect many leavers, have become use to being able to travel for visits to friends without restriction, there is a big difference logistically in turning up at Dover or St Pancras for a short visit compared to travelling from America or say South Africa.
Interestingly a Marie has a month to respond to a request, so it will depend on how helpful or friendly they are. From the frostyness we experienced, it won’t be turn up and will you please sign this, a rdv will have to be made, the papers handed over, and a reply in a due course.
You can travel berween all European counties both inside and outside Schengen area without restriction… UK excepted.
Leavers voted to stop FOM…ie Polish plumbers and Romanian fruit pickers staying in UK, I don’t think they realised they were also voting for removing easy travel!
The big unknown is how aggressively the French will enforce the requirement for Attestation d’accueil?
Perhaps get to know a local friendly gîte owner? And “book” any visitors in there?
This worries me a bit as 2nd home owners will find it difficult to organise unless it can be done by email.
Although you don’t actually need to have pre-booked accommodation as long as you have recourse to 120€/day throughout your stay - which is one of the reasons this requirement is a bit unclear.
It is unclear, because one could argue that someone who owns a property here is not actually “visiting” anyone!
When you look at the procedure for this attestation the first step is all about the person who will be welcoming this stranger into his or her house, their nationality etc etc. And the motive of this cumbersome bureaucracy is to keep track of TCNs. So since a second home owner is not being welcomed by anyone, and is already obvious to the authorities through the taxe d’hab etc this process is rather redundant!
No doubt the British Embassy or Ambassade de France will clarify soon…
This is the link to the original law - it’s nothing new as this has been in force since 2004, but was then only 15€! However no mention of second home owners. I will carry on digging when the next shower of rain appears…
To be blunt this was my first thought for gite/ chambre d’hote owners when they have friends or family come to stay, make them a booking form for the accommodation, then where they end up sleeping and whether cash is exchanged is between them and the pillow they put their head on…
It was more 2nd home owners who want to have friends/family to stay that I was thinking about.
I guess you have to do it by email in advance?
Or even first home owners! Not sure how joined up all of this is going to get, but of course if friends or family are staying as “paying guests”, that then necessitates payment of taxe de sejour!
IIRC from times past on visits to France, Hotels were required to maintain a register of guests (and may have even taken the passports, I can’t recall exactly) but it was the case that the Police/Gendarme would visit and inspect the records of all guests in the hotel.
This stopped if I recall with Schengen but now the big B has impacted on visitors, I can well see this will be resurrected.
Welcome to the wonderful world of Brexit!
Hotels and gîtes still have to keep registers of TCNs… now under terrorism laws but we have to have a register of details of all non-Europeans and hold it for 6 months. It has ever been thus.
The only change is that Brits are now TCNs (troublesome country nationals)
Here’s an interesting set of metrics:
Say are there are around 100,000 British families units living in France permanently…a guess but probably not wildly wrong.
Say each unit has just one family visit a year…so that’s at a minimum 100,000 forms or 1,000 per dept per annum meaning 20 a week!
Whilst per commune (Marie) it might not be a lot but given the Brit population tends to be in clustered areas some Marie’s are going to be busy.
The last time this type of form was required was, I believe, in the early '90s (maybe earlier?) when travel mobility was far less common.
In the 1980/90s…(40 years ago!!) overseas travel was less common and much more of a big event…people have got used to spontaneous travel. In 2017 12.5m Brits visited France…will they really want to make it difficult…particularly for happy holiday makers, a significant number will be visiting relocated friends or traveling on their own flexible itineraries?
I suspect once travel returns to normal this will be questioned.
Time will tell once travel resumes as Covid-19 restrictions reduce.
…or am I clutching at straws and barking up the wrong tree?
There are over 4 million non-european TCNs living in France, who have always been caught up in this regulation. Whether this has been demanded at every border I don’t know, but I imagine the answer is yes for flights coming in from Africa.
And maybe 12 million UK visitors, but 78million from other countries.
I am constantly amazed that British people seem to think our position here is far more significant than it is!
So far 135,000 WARP applications, so maybe 80,000 - 100,000 families. Which is significantly less than 4 million! We truly are troublesome country nationals.
Quite, Brits really are a drop in the ocean of foreigners here in France, and I’ve been selling the said timbres fiscaux ; attestation d’accueil to other TCNs for a numebr of years !
More details here