Basic newbie tax question

Hi all

I will be moving to France at the end of June as an early retiree living from savings. From what I have read I understand my first tax return will be due in May 2019 for tax year 2018. As I am arriving part way through 2018 I am assuming I would complete my tax return based on the date I arrived eg June - Dec 2018.

Thanks in advance.

May 2020 for your first full year in 2019
In this xase you will still report your tax data to who you have been reporting to till the present (HMRC?)

Thanks Graham, yes we are currently paye with HMRC. We both leave our jobs at end of June and I had been concerned that if we submitted tax returns next year this may confuse matters. If we don’t submit until 2020 all is well!

Thanks again

Georgie - you’re absolutely right! Your first tax declaration becomes due in France the year after you take up residence. You’re arriving in June 2018 - therefore your first tax returns will be around April / May 2019 based on your financial activity between the day you became resident and 31 December 2018 (i.e. effectively pro-rated). There is no requirement to be resident for a full year before making a declaration.

Here’s a link to the French Impot’s site (in English) which further clarifies the position:

Moving to France - When / What Income to Declare

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Thanks Simon that’s really helpful will check out the link.

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Hello Georgie

Simon is correct. Also, when you leave the UK you need to tell HMRC. Here’s how to do it:

https://www.gov.uk/tax-right-retire-abroad-return-to-uk

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Super, thanks Mandy!

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Hi, Last year was our first full year in France, and i have downloaded the form 2042 to fill out. My husband and i both had part time jobs last year. I have all the info i need to input into the form. Theres not much, as we dont have a large income just 2 figures to put in. But, even though my french is pretty good, and also with googles help, i am completely confused where to put in our income figures. Can anyone help? I am assuming it is in section 1. Salaires, gains de levee d’options. There are 11 lines to choose from. I would go into our local tax office as they are extremely helpful thre however, due to family circumstances we have had to return to scotland for 2 months. Perfect timing huh? I would be sooo grateful for any help. Thanks

@Carol_Ridley The decision as to where you enter your income figures on your return very much depends on what type of income is it (e.g. work, investments, gites, donations, wins, sales etc) and where it comes from (France, UK, elsewhere) and whether or not it’s already been subject to any taxation - so it’s not possible to answer your question based on the info you’ve provided.

A couple of observations.

You say ‘last year was our first full year in France’ - the need to complete tax declarations is based on when you became resident so - you may have been required to complete part-year returns before now. For example - if you became tax resident in October 2017 - you would need to complete a tax return now. If you became resident in October 2016 - you first returns would have been required in May 2017.

If you have any revenue originating from outside France or from, for example, any rental / commercial activity - you will require additional forms (i.e. as well as your 2042 for 2018 (2017 income) - which isn’t actually available for download yet - so not sure what you’ve downloaded!)

On a general point - you won’t be able to make an online return if this is your first return as a new resident.

Hi Simon, thanks for replying so quickly. Income was from a part time job in france with a french company. We have no other income from anywhere else. Yes we became residents. We have checked and double checked with the tax office before we left and we need to do our first submission now, and on paper then can do following years online.
No revenue originating from outside france. No additional forms required - already double checked this. Definately have downloaded the correct form. Declaration complimentaire revenus 2017. Just yesterday. Does this help? Can you help? Thanks

No Carol you have downloaded form 2042-C - which is for additional revenues not covered by the main form 2042 - not yet available for download as already mentioned (looks like end of April). Form 2042-C needs to be submitted alongside the master declaration 2042.

What I don’t understand is, as you are French residents and have been employed on a part-time basis by a French company last year, you should already have your tax identification numbers (TIN / Numero Fiscal) which would have generated your first pre-filled paper tax returns from this employment. Has someone checked the mail at your French address?

Ah, crap, you are quite right, it is indeed 2042-C. Doh!
I will ask my neighbour to check our mail, but the tax office said we wont have a number till we submit our first one, but will cross our fingers that there is something in the mail. Thanks :laughing: Just in case there isnt, do you know when 2042 will be available online? Thanks again, huge help :laughing:

Yep - as above - around the end of the month.

Maybe the tax office didn’t realise you’d been in French employment…it’ll all work out!

I was thinking the same thing Simon. I have received, as usual, my 2042-K Déclaration Préremplie, which already has my salary printed on it as well as my husband’s pension and all our personal details. All I have to do is fill in the tiny amount of interest from the UK (as well as a schedule of my UK bank accounts) and take it to the tax office.

It only arrived in the last couple of days so it may be in your post box Carol.

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Yep Mandy - thanks for that! Also the really important reminder about decalaring all non-French accounts - nightmare style fines :scream::scream::scream: Here we go…

Fines for failure to report accounts opened, used or closed abroad

In application of the provisions of the second paragraph of Article 1649 A of the CGI persons domiciled or established in France, are required to declare, at the same time as their income tax declaration any accounts opened, used or closed abroad in accordance with the terms and conditions set by decree ( CGI, III, article 344 A and CGI, ann.III, article 344 B ) and commented on at BOI-CF-CPF-30-20 .

Pursuant to Article IV - 2 (IV) IV of the CGI , the breaches of the reporting obligations provided for by the second paragraph of article 1649 A of the CGI and by article 1649 A bis of the CGI entail the application of a fine of €1,500 per account or undeclared advance.

Where the offense relates to the non-declaration of a bank account held in a State or territory that has not concluded an administrative assistance agreement with France with a view to combating tax evasion and tax avoidance access to banking information, the amount of the fine is increased to € 10,000 per undeclared bank account.

When the balance of the accounts not declared at 31 December of a year exceeds 50 000 €, the fixed penalty is replaced by a tax fine of 5% of the amount held in the account abroad (CGI, art 1736, IV )

The fine is applicable to each year in respect of which a declaration was to be filed.

And…just in case anyone loses the plot (!) 2042-K is simply an automatically generated form as opposed to the manual form 2042. Both identical - apart from the ‘K’ - Yawn. :-:stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye::stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye::stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

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Cool, thanks Mandy. Wow! Sounds like a minefield! Fingers crossed and a large deserved wine afterwards i think.

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The delay in the release of the 2042 to download is because the tax authorities want people to use the 2042s that they send out as they include various figures already known to them.
If I was in Scotland facing my first French tax return I would Google The Connexion and fork out the €12 or so to download their tax guide. It covers all the frequently asked questions and is very user friendly and easy to follow.

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I spoke with the French tax office this morning for myself, because this is my first declaration. You declare your earnings in France the year you are living here on the 1st January. I moved here last year in April so I must make a declaration this year. You need ID, proof of address i.e. electricity or water bill and all earnings be it from France and/or the UK., plus pensions if you have some, take these to the tax office next year, during the month of April and they’ll sort everything out for you. You need a French tax return in order to open a bank account and many other things so it’s essential you do it. I hope this was helpful, best regards.

Yep and don’t forget (as above) to declare your overseas bank accounts, life assurance contracts, details of those in your household, whether or not you have a telly, deductibles, and claims for a host of allowances if you’re eligible - I guess the point is, it’s not just about earnings.

Importantly it’s your responsibility to get it right - not the guys in the local tax office. They can be incredibly helpful but the buck stops with you. :slight_smile:

I think the point is “can you speak fluent French” I can so I never have any problems. If you can’t I suggest you go with someone who can. Yes, it is up to you to make a true declaration, I believe in being completely honest, that way you’ll have no problems. The woman I spoke to this morning told me to take all the necessary that I mentioned before and then I’ll be able to make the declaration there and then. I’m going next week so if there are any problems or differences in what I’ve told you I’ll let you know. Again best regards.