Franglais Kids

Oh Sara how horrendous. This poor, poor family and yes, I do send my prayers and thoughts to them for a miracle.
I shall certainly tell my 14 year old son but thankfully, unlike most of the French kids, he always wears his helmet and we can not wrap them in cotton-wool but it is scary when you read something like this.

I just wanted to share this awful news with you all, so you can send some good wishes out to this family - we run a property management business here in France and having contacted one of our clients, with whom we are also good friends, we were shocked to hear that they could not make it over this half term as their 15 year old son had been involved in a terrible cycling accident. He skidded in the park when out with his mates and had somersaulted over a wall and fallen 20 feet down into a tidal river, where he had landed on rocks and the tide was coming in. The scene was engolfed with medical, fire, police and TV crew and the rescue was difficult especially when they discovered he had a broken pelvis. It was later discovered his pelvis was in fact shattered and his leg was not attached to anything. He has subsequently undergone extensive surgery and has been litterally screwed back together - now it is a waiting game as the doctors have told his family there is at least a 30% chance that the bones could die. Please spare a thought for this family and their son lying in agonising pain in a Kent hospital, include them in your prayers and wish him a full recovery. Also use this tale to tell your own children of the dangers when on a bike!

I definitely agree that a lot of the positive influence will come from home. This year I was as active as posisble in my daughter’s school and I plan on continuing to do so. But one of the things I love about American schooling is all the extra curricular activities. I would love both of my kids to participate in sports and clubs but it looks like the work load once you reach CP in France is so heavy that they don’t have time! While teaching English here, I saw way too many teens being pushed to take English classes on a Saturday morning when all they really wanted to do was play sports or go to a movie. It was depressing seeing that the kids didn’t have any free time even in their free time!

Unfortunately you do not always have the possibility to change things, especially when it comes to state institutions! If your French is up to scratch, you can make yourself heard, but whether it just triggers a slight smirk, or actually changes something, I don’t know. I decided to go private for my daughter, because I felt that the local maternelle did not have on offer, what I think is necessary for my child. Call me an individualist, a dreamer… Now she is educated in both EN and Fr and she is supported in building her own personality. And that is all I wanted. I am sure schooling is equally debated in many countries, since the average schooling system does stem from the ideas of the industrial age. There is loads of research that has been done on this subject on passive learning. Sure if I could not send my daughter to another school, I’d have to go state and make the best out of it. Especially where here, you cannot chose where to go, because the schools are so oversubscribed and yet classes are still being closed. It’s a long and passionate topic, for sure. :wink:

I’d love to change the world but I’m not ambitious enough! However, living in France has taught me that even though I can’t change the system, I can change how I deal with it and how to get the most out of it. It does get me down occasionally but you mustn’t let it get to you and I truly believe that it’s no good whining about it, you have to do your bit to get things changed. Isn’t there an old saying, something about changing the things you can, accepting the things you can’t change and the wisdom to know the difference.
And on that note, I’m switching of this computer and changing the cleanliness of my house and counting the days till school starts again, for better or for worse!

Oh, to inspire the older son we pushed him to join a local film club where he spent every spare waking moment his whole last year of high school. He worked with semi-professionals on films and worked as animator, set manager, assistant director. For the other son we hired home tutors from Academia which helped him immensely on his self-esteem and confidence, his speaking and writing on top of his general knowledge (which was never the problem). For each son, we found the best solution to inspire them to deal with school in a more positive way.

Tracy you are right! Actually, I served as parent representative for one son through collège and the other through high school and heard all of the teachers as well as proviseurs. I did speak up - quite often - which surprised the teachers to no end! Luckily the high school proviseur was on my side so something moved a bit. If I could do something, anything to change the way things are I would. Any suggestions?

How did this descend into another - oh the French school system is rubbish, conversation. Rebecca asked for some positive feedback as she had already heard so much negativity. If the system is so bad - then do something about it, you can’t change the system necessarily but you can change how you deal with it, home educate, go private, move to another country.
There was recent coverage in the UK papers about Gary Lineka’s son - apparently he was totally let down by his school - ‘Charterhouse’, supposedly one of the best public schools in the country. He only got 3 'B’s at A level - and as it is practically impossible to fail A levels these days that is a pretty grim grade when you have spent all that money!
However, nobody has questioned that it might be the sons fault, the parent’s fault - or perhaps the kid is just not academically inclined. Why is it always the fault of the school these days?
My brother and I were totally different, I went to a grammar school, he the local comp, I got the A levels, much more was made of his 3 CSE’s (grades d and E!) but, we both ended up travelling the same career paths, living overseas etc. Kids are all different, there is never going to be a system that suits everyone - you have to make your own success, hopefully the school will help, if it doesn’t suit your child, find a path that does and in the meantime, it’s not such a bad thing, as I said before, if the child can read, write and spell correctly. In my opinion, it’s pointless knowing how to think outside the box if you think it’s spelt ‘bocks’!

Claudia, my French husband says exactly what you just said: the French system hasn’t changed since the Middle Ages when school was only meant for the top 1/3% of the population. Today only the top third find their way to better than average grades thus leading them to the few coveted spaces in any prepa program, the ideal path for the ideal student. Those who “succeed” are not necessarily the smartest but rather those best adapted to the system and whose parents went up the same path (thus understand the system). I find the system extremely cruel to any kid who is “different” - like our kids - and whose parents question the system. The kid must adapt to the mold to make it to the top. As you say, there are always exceptions to any rule, but this is usually the way it works. And, ah yes, discipline. Neither the school system nor French society really has a place for anyone who questions, anyone who takes responsibility, anyone who thinks out of the box. Until university - not fac but certain schools like architecture, cinema, etc where all of a sudden one must be creative and think out of the box. Oy, what a complicated subject!

Unfortunately this is what I have heard from my friends too. It’s pretty much a system that mirrors the idea of school during the industrial age, children a big empty vessels that need feeling, passive filling. And a 1/3 of all children bloom with that approach, 1/3 kind of get by, and the last third fail miserably. It’s all to often comments like: you are good, but… your grade is good, but. The whole system seems full of negativity. And goal is to teach discipline as early as possible for preparation for life in society (and that from age 3…).
I am sure there are exceptions and that there are wonderful teachers out there. But also all to often do I hear quite the opposite.

I agree with Kathryn but I would like to warn Tracy and Rebecca that althought the US system is overly positive, our experience (in several different schools, both public and private) was that the French ideology is “punishment makes the child work harder for approval!” I’ve had teachers tell me this! Harder grading, lower grades just make the kid work harder. Unfortunately it usually has the opposite effect. How many kids - like my own - have by high school come to the conclusion “why work harder when I will only get bad grades anyway?” I know I sound really hard on the French system and extremely negative, but the experiences we have lived through with both our sons - one who enjoyed school the other who was miserable - was mostly negative no matter how much we did for them at home. My advice is to spend as much time as possible working with your kids, reading with them, educating them outside of school (travel, museums, documentaries, etc) and mostly get to know and understand the system - collège, lycée, bac, bac pro, bac techno, all of their future options as early as possible.

Hi Rebecca,
I think the most important thing is that you are aware and taking an interest in your childrens’ education. I firmly believe there is no ‘perfect’ education system in the world, they all have strengths and weaknesses and it’s up to us as parents to fill the holes - personally I like the focus on the basics but miss the creativity in the UK system so they do creative after school activities. We have had our share of good and bad teachers, just as we would have found in the UK. I’ve resisted the temptation to jump ship in the bad year in the belief that the child will catch up with the next teacher who is good.
As a teacher yourself you have the training to teach your children English and there are several good sites for multilingual children, after all there are more multilinguals than monolinguals in this world!
Good luck,
Kathryn

To Tracy, thanks for your insight. The teacher is confirmed to be terrible by the previous years’ parents. She is often out for extended periods and the kids are dispered through the school. A friend said she had the impression her child learned nothing new between PS and MS. Not reassuring but we are being positive with my daughter.
As for my son, it’s so hard not to compare. My daughter was already speaking in both languages by the time she was 14 months. So far all my son says besides “papapapa” and “mamamama” is “buh” and “guh”. We adhere very strictly to OPOL - I speak English and my husband speaks French and we have never swayed. But I think you tend to be less active with the second child. Plus the fact that he can’t make it through more than 3 minutes of reading (my daughter could happily sit through an entire Charlie and Lola book at the age of 1).
As a former English teacher, I believe that reading is a great ressource. And so far school hasn’t damaged my daughter or her self-esteem. Granted, American schools tend to be too positive, ie telling kids they did well even if it was the stupidest answer ever heard…

Tracy,
my thoughts exactly, well put!
Vivienne

I haven’t popped in here for a while but thought I would put in my two cents for what it is worth. My boys are now 20 and 22, were born in France (I’m American, husband is French), older son started maternelle in France then when we moved to Italy they both were in Italian pre-school & grade school. We moved back to France when they were 8 & 10 and were back in the French system. Just to say that we always read - and it worked for us - that the languages should be separated and clearly defined in either one language-one parent (1 always speaks English the other always French) or one language-one space (French is always for school, English for home). Worked for us. We always made sure they had plenty of videos in all 3 languages (not crap, rather movies in which we knew the language was correctly spoken and rich in vocab) to make sure they had plenty of vocabulary in each language. I had an American friend in Italy whose 2 sons were the same age as mine yet they spoke English and Italian together all at once so the boys didn’t understand really that they were 2 separate languages, each spoken by different people or in different places. Very strange.

Hi Rebecca,
I just love my kids schooling over here in France. I don’t have anything to compare it to as my children were born here but between us we have experienced practically everything available up to the age of 6.
My daughter is thriving here, she is totally bilingual, can write beautifully, she can read in English and will start to read in French this year when she enters CP. Both the children love school lunch and eat loads of veggies and all french food, they have been toilet trained since a young age, had good manners reinforced at school and I wouldn’t for a minute swap it for a UK system.
Maybe the education is a little rigid but is it such a bad thing to have good handwriting, be able to spell and know the times tables. It may be classed as antiquated but it served me well in the 70’s in the UK and I’m sure it’ll do them fine here, especially as I intend to keep up their English education at the same time. I strongly believe it won’t come naturally, they will have to be taught to read, write and spell in English, just like in French.
Who says the new teacher is terrible? She may not be, don’t let your daughter believe it as it may not be true - give the lady a chance. Your one year old is in the perfect place to learn French, well before he starts school. My son was also a bit late starting to speak, it’s natural with little ones - they are taking in an incredible amount of knowledge but wow, what a bonus for them.
Don’t worry, they will be fine. I know many young people who have been very successful over here and the important thing is that you believe they will be and that will rub off on them. Too many people berate the system when it’s not necessarily the system’s fault.

Wow! There are so many negative stories about the French school system for bilinguals. Anyone have something positive to say? I’m feeling a bit down myself about my 4 yo daughter starting in moyenne section with a terrible teacher and my 1 y.o. son starting at the crèche and not speaking a word in French or English yet! Someone tell me something positive please!

Catharine suggested I should let you know too about my new website:
Well, I am not in your area. I am down south a bit more… :wink:
But I recently opened my web shop of organic baby (and mum and household) items.
Everything you need for the little ones just up to 2 years of age and loads of things for body and soul for mums and future mums.
Idea behind the site is to really look out for the ingredients present in cosmetics, clothing, toys etc. Even though we talk organic a lot, not every organic item is really that! Unfortunately manufacturers are not always that transparent.
The site is work in progress, I will add loads more infos on labels, ingredients etcetc.
Have a look:
www.zonebebe.fr
It is in 3 languages.
Comments welcome.
Have a nice day
Claudia

Hi Daniel - SurviveFrance is a group for English speakers in France which is why we’re writing in English :slight_smile:

If you’re looking for things to do with your kids this summer and you live in Dept 47 check out Tex Atlier, they have all sorts of craft activities and offer ‘Arty Parties’ http://facilitutors.com/index.php?ch=15&id=309