David I didn't say I don't believe you but that my experience with Mars many years ago was very different. Plus a lifetime in Marketing meant I spent a lot of time in factories and one client was a company called Eurowide Engineering who made automated flowlines for many industries including the auto one. I learned a great deal about how production lines operate from them and many other clients.
It would appear that my experience with Trade Unions is far more extensive than yours, notably in the 'trade' context. I was a compulsory Member of SLADE (Society of Lithographic Artists & Designers) in London for many earlier years including the times of the Wapping strikes. Even then the Unions used blackmail and even less solubrious methods in forcing membership on anyone involved in any form of print. No membership - no printing was available to you. Simple, brutal fact.
The Union like most, gave members NOTHING, zilch, zero, nowt, nicht but the Union 'Leadership' lived very well thank yoy very much (anyone noticed the lifestyle of the exCFGT Leader here in France?).
Far from your expectation that we think of teachers as Right-wing, that again is not my feeling - in fact exactly the opposite, as I feel the majority of teachers are usually left-wing than anything.
Finally as a Principle I am not against Trade Unionism, although I do believe that most of what they fought for in the early days is now enshrined in Law. As with many things the Principle is fine but the Practice is all too often something else again. I think it is fair to say that just as many workers are now users of transport systems as any others, so it seems curious that Unions no longer think in terms of 'solidarity' through association, but have the more 'what's in it for me?' mentality. I certainly don't think they have any kind of moral superiority to fall back on.
Yes, I am aware that the Air Traffic Controllers Union is probably called right-wing, but as their actions are affecting every strata of society that is not over-relevant.
You again use the term 'sometimes' with regard to Governments and others, it would be nice to be able to use the same word with the regular and persistent transport union strikes that infest this country.
Ahh, but they have a 'right' to strike Jane and we have no 'right' to complain! Of course if they'd booked a holiday and the accommodation providers went on strike they'd be the ones doing the moaning......because it's their 'right' to have a holiday when & where they choose!!
I am replying to my own post because I have just called my daughter and she will have to 'phone her husband about the best time for me to change my dates for my trip.
He is in Austria at the bedside of his granny, who helped bring him up, and who is in the last hours of her life. Just where do these people get off? They are a national/international service and their right to strike should be limited by law.
Karma, karma or for me calmer, calmer!
My son & family were due to arrive today and their flights have been cancelled! As the only other flight they could take, due to work commitments!!!, is tomorrow they have no chance of getting here as it's likely that will be cancelled too. They're having a nightmare trying to explain to their 6 year daughter why she can't come and stay with gran & granddad, I'm with you on this Jane!
I agree 100%. As I said in my reply... take it to the wall and an all out total strike and stand your ground for what you believe in until its resolved... a true "last resort". These annual on peak strikes are nothing but a disgrace and shame on the Unions.
After reflecting on this problem, I find it amazing that people who behave so responsibly during their working hours can suddenly become so irresponsible with regard to the problems they are causing for their fellow men/women.
Just remember karma folks, there is a price to pay for this.
Yes there are, but then I would have to carry my own luggage from one platform to the other and I find that difficult as I have one arm which is much weaker than the other.
Also, I would have either to travel via Paris, or make two changes.
You seem to think that I have not considered this option, but I obviously have and found it unacceptable.
Also the cost is ridiculous.
David re. Mars. Many eons ago I worked in Mars in Slough on shiftwork, mainly on the Christmas lines which were packs of assorted products. Now I happily accept that times have changed but I was very surprised to read about the lines speed being controlled by the packers? Even in my time that was never an issue,and I am sure the packaging by a company like Mars would compare favorably with any in the world, and I have never heard of this as any sort of problem.
The usual problem area is in loading the 'feeders' and ensuring continuity of product on the lines.
Funny when I read of the '40-minute limit as the maximum concentration time' My shift was eight-hours with a 40-minute break. Times really have changed.
David
this does not answer my point - whether I am anti-Union or not (and I make no secret that I am anti-French unions who do not use a strike as the last weapon, but the first and only). It is the use of BLACKMAIL by the Trade Unions against the Company using innocent people as the weapon.
You may find this laudable, but I don't. Also your assumption that somehow air carriers are not concerned about air safety borders on the ludicrous and dare I say it reflective of typical Trade Unionists where only they are 'right' and everyone else including the travelling public are 'wrong'.
As a fervent Trade Unionist perhaps you can explain to me and possibly others how it is that (apparently) these issues come up EVERY year and at the same times? Traffic and passenger loads are heaviest of course,but I suggest don't vary greatly, so why are your trade unions not able to work out a satisfactory deal for say five years? Or is that not really the point? Is it just a (juvenile) demonstration that you can disrupt the business and personal lives of others at a whim?
Do you and your Trade Union make efforts to help recruit more people to be trained and reduce the strain? I would be surprised if that featured in your demands.,
I repeat that air safety is not the issue here in this debate, but the Blackmail employed using innocent people just wanting to get on with their lives.
Jill,
to be honest you must have little or no knowledge of how, where and when trains run - least of all internationally, and how long they take. Anyway the French Cheminots Union usually manages to work in tandem with other unions at these times, and I admit to being a little surpised this has not happened this year.
Why is this reply being put anywhere but in relation to the comment I want it to refer to?
Voice of reason eventually
Voice of reason eventually.
I have promised to go to see my grandson in Munich so that he can show his granny off at kindergarten.I will be travelling by Lufthansa and German airlines have just had a telling off for employing too few people to maintain safety standards and now the French are going on strike again.
Apart from perhaps making me break my promise to my grandson, when are people going to realise that they are not a special case and everyone nowadays has to have their pension and retirement age reviewed? It is quite simple it is called demographics.
Quite honestly I have not a good word to say about both Lufthansa or French Air-Traffic Controllers. I hate flying into Munich, the staff are so aggressive and it is only because I am a good Granny that I am doing this at all.
Perhaps they would come and explain to my grandson if I am unable to fly?
Safety cannot be of prime concern if they are not at work to exercise it. French TAX has always been obstructive and likely to change a flight plan just for the he'll of it. I have absolutely no problem with UK ATC, always very flexible and helpful.
Unhappy! was hoping to get away on Thu...oh dear!
Lis, Dick, David,
I don't think anyone would deny the stress, any more than we would about the police forces, gendarmes, military and fire brigades who put their OWN lives far more on the line than air traffic controllers, but who you almost never hear going on strike.
OK if you support self-seeking( mainly) Trade Unions then of course you will by definition support the fact that such strikes are targetted at the very people who can't do a dam' thing about the issues. As such the timing of these strikes is just to 'blackmail' those who can.
If you have a case against an employer and are a Unionist, then why not strike as and when the issue refuses to be discussed by the employer? Not wait to ruin the holidays of other people who also work for a living and have a right to their breaks.
THAT is the issue here, not the rights of the Unionist case.
It's very stressful. So is teaching….. and nobody seems to want the job either!
Their job is extremely stressful…my stepfather was is the business, have never understood why anybody would want such a streeful job, the amount of stomach ulcers and the rest + and sick leave is something else…a very tough job…they are looking after our safety ‘up there’ and there are lots of planes up there…not an easy job…