Lost in France

General Discussion
1

My French wife and I moved to France nearly 4 years ago,planning to start a new life and to be near her family,we had lived in the UK together since 1996 and we were married in France in 2003,all looked good at first we had had a rough time in UK,We had lost our first baby at 7 months term but we carried on and we were gifted with a beautiful son born in the UK in 2008,and then this was the start of our downfall even before moving to France in 2009 we had started to take each other for granted and we ploughed on bought our house in France my wife worked and I stayed at home and looked after our son and became Homme au foyer and enjoyed it feeling that most men never get the chance to bond so much with thier children when they are so younge,when he started to go to school I started to get some intrim work around our area at the moment I am doing a course in French gramma


A week ago I found out that my wife had been having internet sex on French flirt sites I have the proof that she has been with 3 or 4 men and chatted with lots more on at least 8 diffrent sites and she has exchanged phone numbers and e-mail addresses with one in perticular,I even read in the e-mails with this man that he had told her to do things with me and then she had to and report back to him the details,I am sick and sickend as I always have trusted her 100% and all this has been happening litraly under my nose,myself although through the last years have felt unloved I would never cheat on anyone as I think I like to treat people as I would like to be treated,She tells me it was nothing and she was querious after reading the book `fifty shades of gray`,I have since found a text message on her phone in which he says a week has passed and he is missing her,


My plea is what to do ?I am a big beliver in comunication,but I do not know where I stand in French marrage law,I have no proof except the telephone that they have met at all, and is it Adultery on the internet?if so what is the Alimony conditions with this sort of thing ?Last but not least of all My son has a Uk passport and I would like custerdy of him I have spent so much time with him I have been mother and farther to him can I take him back to the Uk? although my wife is a good mother I am afriend some of her brothers and my brother in laws are to free with the hands and I have seen little children being slapped on the head and I fear that he would be left with family if he was to stay with my wife,Do I stay in France and what to I need to do if I do stay in France ? I understand that the Assurance can help me but I do not know were to start ?

2

Hi Wayne, I know of a situation similar to yours. A close friend of mine had the same experience of her partner chatting and going out with ladies (she found out later). My friend was disabled and I think her OH was looking for a physical relationship which he couldn't have with his wife due to her disability. He was not out to abandon their marriage though. She found out about the chat rooms and asked him to stop, which he promised to do, but actually continued doing.

So my first comment is that these chat rooms and internet dating sites can be like an addiction. Even if your wife says she will stop she might be 'hooked in'. So for that, she and you need help on how to deal with and manage addictive behaviour.

Secondly, from what I understand, the trust has gone from your relationship, at least from your side. I can tell you from personal experience (because my first husband did something serious to break my trust and although I think I am a forgiving person, this trust could never be rebuilt) that if you feel you could trust her again then you have a chance, if not, it's better to face reality sooner than later.

Thirdly, despite what people say about children from broken homes - yes, it's true they don't have both parents under the same roof, but in my opinion it's better to have two happier separated parents than living in a home of mistrust, fighting, arguing and other adult behaviour which is not favourable.

Can you forgive her and start over? Is she aware that you know about her online life? And do you think she can and will give that up?

I agree with what the others have said in getting some help, legally, family-wise (if possible), counselling, and also find out what she wants to do, but don't rush off with your son - I think that would really go against you in many ways.

3

I did not brake into her computer I caught her chatting to a man online all of the sites were open when I clicked on them,and the e-mails were deleted from her inbox but not from the deleted box and her e-mail box was open I do not have any of her passwords, I asked her that I might look at her phone but there was nothing on it all deleted,I got the infurmation about the messaging and phone calls it was written in the e-mails,maybe that is why tonight she has told me she will be home late after work and I do not know where she will be.

4

Thank you Ben,

I appreciate the time you have spent writing the reply and your advice

thank you again

5

Good advice !!!!

6

I agree with Nick and Andrew - what an awful situation for you, particularly with no-one to talk it over with. It occurs to me that the kind of behaviour your wife has indulged in suggests a certain level of immaturity. I'm happy to read in one of your more recent posts that you and your wife are at least talking about it. She needs to be aware that her teenage behaviour has put the relationship at serious risk, and as you have already pointed out, the knock-on effect for your son. I hope things work out for you and I wish you the very best.

7

Hi Wayne; first of all I feel sorry for you. This must be a rather devastating experience, especially when you also need to consider the wellbeing of a kid that didn't ask for this situation. What I read from your postings is that you yourself are not too decided in this whole affair, but want to prepare for the worst case scenario in order not to be outsmarted by your French wife knowing her ways around the system much better than you.

As for the technicalities of this case they're pretty straightforward: you could demand a divorce. The French justice system recognizes that cheating your partner is more than just the "carnal act". Being faithful to you partner implies also the moral and affective side of a relationship. This last one is concerned in your case and constitutes, given the relatively long and intrusive way of your wife's relationship, a direct reason for a "divorce pour faute".

As for submitting the proof of your wife's behavior, not all courts will allow proof that is obtained by breaking into your wife's personal phone or computer but there's definite growing jurisprudence allowing it. However if these are used by the both of you then there is no problem at all and copies of the SMS-es, mails and whatever pertains to the case can be filed as proof of your wife's "fault".

But the biggest worry for you is obviously your kid. And I won't lie to you on that subject; French family courts rule generally in favor of the mother when it comes to custody of the child. But the fact that you've basically raised the kid, started to gain some personal income and -last but not least- the fact that it is your wife who committed the "moral adultery" might well be working in your favor. Moving to the UK might weaken your case for custody as you would deny his mother the visiting rights that she will get in the case you obtain the custody.

I would strongly suggest that you visit a lawyer just to be clear on your position which doesn't mean that you would have to go ahead with the divorce. The costs can be covered by an insurance (if you have one). Another possibility is to go to your local Mairie and arrange an appointment (free of charge) with an "assistant social", someone who knows his/her ways into the system, to obtain more information. If language is a barrier you can search this site some of the SFN-ers did suggest English speaking lawyers.

But on a personal note: someone made a comment earlier about taking the "man-pill". I would suggest the same, not to turn you into a solely testosterone-driven macho, but to shape up after the initial blow and decide what it is you really want, for yourselves. In my humble opinion the staying-together-because-there's-a-kid-reflex is very understandable but in the end doesn't work and can be equally harmful for the kid when there's no trust and simply too less love in the relationship of his/her parents.

But if you want to go for your relationship with her and your kid, go for it but be very clear about where your limits lie, what you will and won't accept; mark your ground in a clear way and rebuild from there on. Try to establish what went wrong and how to solve these issues. Communication is a great thing, but sometimes a bit more force is needed.....

Courage!

8

David I understand some of what you are saying,Firstly I was used in their relationship as I seaid in my first post my wife was told to do things with me and then report back to him although I find it strange each to thier own but tell me if I am wrong I did not concent to these acts I did not know at the time that she was reporting back in detail I have read since,I had always trusted my wife 150% in the past as I do not belive it is healthy to be possesive or jelous although my wife has been very possesive in the past,and I know that two wrongs do not make it right but my wife used to open my snail mail and e-mails against my will but I never had anything to hide I felt it was an infridgement on my privicy so I understand what you say,but this time and the one and only time as I had cought her in act so to say I looked through her e-mails and her profil on these sights,(which do you know are not free and the cost can add up)I also copied everything that I could thinking that it would be evidance, old habits die hard it was part of my work when I was in the uk,So I married in France and in the eyes or Religion L`adultere is a sexual act with a person other than your spouse,I have proof that this has happend,I agree that normaly the court would rate the `mother child` relationship and so do I but my view in this is that for most of my childs life I have played a sort of mother role all except breast feeding,I would also be the main earner if I went back to the UK,I have seen in some French casses that there has been no allomony settelments in certain cases,and moraly it is wrong why is it one of the ten comandments ?

So lets hope that we do not have to go down this route I am by now way a saint but I would never cheat on my wife,We have a beautiful son who it would be best for if we could find the sulotion and remain good perants,It is to easy to devorce these days and the best things in life are never the easy route,for me the easy route is for lazy people,

So I say It is my trust that has been affected there is no physical pain but belive me the mental pain for me is like a spinning black fog of dought and unanswered questions,I do not belive I am the first that this has happend to or the last,but due to the stigma on both sides I feel alone as I cann`t talk to anyone who is not conected with both of us so would be unfair on them and us

9

Wayne I feel your pain but apart from your wife having a life to which you are not privy what real harm has been done to you. What makes you think you have the right to investigate your wife's emails? Even Jimmy Carter had qualms about committing adultery in his heart. Talk to your wife. However don't be under any illusions that any family court either here or in UK will do other than rate the Mother Child relationship ahead of any claim you may have. If you choose to remove your child to UK then you will have even more problems. If your marriage has truly broken down over this then better for both of you to bite the bullet and end it although it seems a pretty paltry reason for doing so. And yes I have been there. And it was all my fault

10

As the working wife of an early retired husband, I know some of the frustration that can arrise in this situation. Surely it would be better all round to try and seek help, look perhaps to what you can do to help support the family? It is very hard swapping roles so completely and it takes alot of frank and open chat and also both parties being willing to look at what works, what doesn.t and what needs to change.

If your wife wants to work things out surely you should try? Perhaps the reality of her working actualy isn’t what she really wants? Getting the legal side involved always seems to mean divorce, but going to seek out counsiling and both being willing to changeusually means things can be worked out. Please don’t think about taking your son to the UK and leaving your wife behind, that would be too cruel.

11

Thank you for all your advice,

I was really looking for someone who might of experianced something like this or how I could get intouch with someone who could explain the legal side to me,as I feel I do need to be prepared for any event,I do not know if in this case it is fantasy I have found 83 e-mails and over 60 hours of pornographic chat with my wife on these porn sites,I think as soon as e-mails and phone numbers are exchanged it removes it from being just fantasy,Now though my bigest concern is for my younge son although we are trying to talk this through and as I seaid in the earlier post what we think caused us to take each other for granted and we agree that we are both to blame for this,my concern is that that the other man is trying to contact her on the phone and e-mail although she tells me that she phoned him to tell him that she wanted to try to work it out with me ?and on this point I did not realise how easy in France and with the internet it is to find out information about people I was able to find out everything about this man just by using his e-mail address so If I can do this then he can do the same maybe I am being paranoid in thinking that he might turn up at my door ? I am big enough and ugly enough not to worry about this but it is my son that I worry about to see this or even be involved after all he had no choice in all this,After all we do not know how weird some people are that use these type of sites on the internet

12

I think he may have been drinking. No offence here. We share one phone anyway.

13

Keith,

What a sad response. Given the time it was lodged I take it that it was drink fuelled or possibly late because you had been doing all of your checks and filling in reports!

14

What do you mean by that Keith?

15

Flirting on the Internet seems to be a common thing.I suppose some people think it's OK as nothing physical actually happens (not sure if this is the same in your case) I would be very upset if my husband did this,but am sure it happens loads without the other party finding out .Maybe it will blow over,maybe she is getting all she needs from this long distance flirting? Could you leave things for a while and wait it out. I think many a marriage has been finished over a passing fancy.If yours has been a good one up till now, perhaps waiting would be worth it.

16

Wayne,

You need to toughen up, take a man pill and look to see what has caused this. She has done nothing wrong, and has committed no crime. All she seems to have done is look for some excitement. The Internet seems to be the place that she can find it.

Sit down and discus it with her.

17

I am sorry this has happened to you. It must be awful.

I would be very wary of letting your wife know of any of your intentions, you are in France, she is French and your son is half French. She could act so much more quickly if this situation involved lawyers etc.

I do agree with Sarah, your wife needs to feel how badly you have been let down and the hurt you are feeling and you need to be able to talk this through with the help of someone qualifiied to guide you through this nightmare.

Does she have access to your computer, as she would surely not be pleased to see what you are now writing?

Take care and I wish you all a happy outcome.

18

So sorry to hear this - you must be going through hell

My first instinct was to suggest couple therapy to work on the reason why your wife has done this and then explore if you are able to forgive her. You have already spoken to her and she has played it down as nothing serious; for some reason she is not ready to open up about what is wrong and that is where the professionals can help.

Even if, for her, this is nothing, she needs to understand the impact this has on you regardless of how well she tries to smooth it over with her words.

How is your social network? Do you have people you can talk to confidentially?

I would also, without saying anything to your wife at this time, get in touch with a lawyer so you know how the land lies as far as custody issues go and how alimony etc would work

Again, really sorry to hear this; as Andrew says, what a shitty situation

19

What a $hitty situation, Wayne, as Nick says, try to communicate and get to the bottom of what has actually happened and, if possible, why. Communication seems to be the key here. I wouldn't talk openly about going back to the UK yet, especially taking your son with you, it could play against you.

Chin up and best of luck ;-)

20

Thanks Nick, for your kind words,I never thought it would happen to us,It is my son that I am most concerend about as he did not make any choices in this,and If I forgive can I ever trust again ?