This could have been so much worse if it weren’t for the bravery of two PCSOs and the fast response time of the Police.
4 Likes
Yes it was very impressive seeing videos of unarmed police officers running towards god knew what without hesitation
Greater Manchester may well be one of the forces who have sent officers to London on mutual aid and then something like that happens
3 Likes
It wasn’t a terror attack after all but a man with mental health problems. He was still dangerous though and the police did a fantastic job responding and subduing him so quickly.
2 Likes
Define Terror?
Sounds terrifying to me or is Terror only applicable to religion followers?
1 Like
There is a difference between terror as in being scared and terror as in a crime
It’s not me defining what is or is not a terror attack it’s the Police.
Presumably, the Police use this specific definition.
2 Likes
The fact that people are terrified by an incident is not evidence that the person whose behaviour terrified them had that intent.
If you saw a child hanging out of a tenth floor window it would terrify you, but the child would not be a terrorist.
I’ve confronted many terrifying situations as a mental health nurse but I wasn’t terrified because I had the necessary awareness to separate perception from reality.
Police officers have the same or similar capabilities which is why they don’t fear to approach someone with a bladed weapon to disarm them.
1 Like
I was talking more in terms of a legal definition not people’s emotions
@anon22869222*“was talking more in terms of a legal definition not people’s emotions”*
In that case terrorism is just an allegation against an individual and cannot be applied justly or legitimately to him or his actions until proved before a court of law.
The words terrorist and terrorism are too casually deployed in order to raise the spectre of terror in the public mind, to create fear and loathing against a faceless enemy.
So 1984 in the 21st century.
Woah. John said he would have been scared so why wasn’t it Terrorism I said there is a difference in the law and the emotion Mandy provided the CPS definition ,what on earth did I do to merit this?
I have been reading this forum for a while now as my much loved France forum closed quite quickly and I wanted an alternative I have been ill all week and off work sick so thought I would join and contribute some thoughts , perhaps it wasn’t a good idea
@anon22869222 Whoa!
Oh dear Mary, didn’t mean to offend you. I like your contributions lots and am glad you joined the forum, really.
I can come across combative at times, but it’s just my written style is more pugnacious than I am in person, though I like robust discussions, even sometimes over the cheese plate.
Sorry also to hear you’re unwell, and wish a rapid return to feeling better.
I am touchy about the stigmatisation of the mentally ill. Since the Tory run-down of mental health services many people terrified by delusional persecutory ideas and hallucinations, and nowhere to turn for support are being driven to a state of terror themselves, and lash out in mortal fear.
They are then arrested, tasered and locked up, often for days until seen by a doctor. Many end up in prison because there is no suitable accommodation for them in the few privately operated units which cost the taxpayer a fortune in fees, and are anything but therapeutic. I know, I’ve worked in them, and they’re much worse than the old asylums were IMO.
Anyway, let’s start again, can we, and I wish you nothing but well.
BTW my youngest son was diagnosed with paranoid schizophrenia aged 18 and his life has been ruined by the treatment he’s had, and the disgraceful lack of care and support by the NHS. Every family tells the same story, and it’s getting worse, the stigmatisation, the “psycho” labelling, the cruelty and the bullying.
So he wasn’t black or brown, then, presumably.
Usually the story is black or brown = terrorist, white = person with mental problems or possibly lone wolf.
Funny that.
3 Likes
From the picture on Mandy’s link… he had one white leg, certainly. 
1 Like
Incidentally, I would rather that something was labelled “suspicion of terror” initially - whereby all the systems click into place… than for a different/lighter label to be used and too late find out that the incident is, in fact,one part of a bigger planned-horror.
2 Likes
That was one of the issues in Manchester those officers could have been running towards a suicide bomber, a planted device , other armed people etc
2 Likes
That was my thought as well Vero. I don’t think we have enough information though at the moment.
Sorry to hear of your sons problems. It must have been hard for him and yourselves to cope with especially with a lack of care and support from the agencies supposed to help you Sadly many families suffer the trauma of mental illness these days mine is among them although not as severely affected as yours
However I am perturbed by the image you portray of the police seemingly routinely tasering the mentally ill arresting them and throwing them into cells on a long term basis. Mental health care in the Uk ( for the chronically ill ) is very poor but not quite at that level yet
I think the Police have to consider the worse case scenario when going to an attack of this kind. They have to at least be prepared to confront someone who is happy to die for his cause and take with him as many people as possible.
Terrorist or not this man was incredibly dangerous and the Police really had no option but to declare a suspected terror attack.
4 Likes
I am sure you would be the first to agree @Peter_Goble that the Police are not qualified or able to perform a psychiatric evaluation when someone is on the rampage.
They will quite rightly subdue any offender whether they are suffering with a mental illness or not, even if this sometimes involves a taser.
4 Likes
I don’t blame the police for whom I have immense respect, and U appreciate that they do their professional best under what are often intolerable conditions.
I blame the government for its studied neglect of the problem of totally inadequate provision for seriously mentally ill and 'learning disabled’people of whom there are far more than is usually acknowledged, some with families ill-equipped and neglected in their efforts to protect them, and help them live fulfilled and meaningful lives in safety.
2 Likes