Survive France Users' Brexit Poll

:joy::joy::joy: I love the idea of the Royal Canin diet :joy:

actually, in my teens, I used to munch on the small red biscuits in Winalot or whatever the packet was called… never did me any harm… at least not that I’ve noticed :upside_down_face:

1 Like

Spiller’s Shapes, and best of all Bonios. Those, bits of carob pod picked out of sheepfood, and the horses’ mints… delicious😊

1 Like

7 Likes
6 Likes

I’m in two minds about the idea of a second referendum. The first demonstrated why referenda are a bad way to settle complex issues and repeating the question until you get the answer that you want is hardly democratic. On the other hand we really need to stop Brexit in the short term because it must be obvious to even a blind stoat that it isn’t going well. What we need is a reasoned debate as to what we actually want from our relationship with the EU and dialogue with the 27 about the direction the whole project should be going. Unfortunately with nutters like Rees-Mogg I doubt we’d get the debate that we need.

5 Likes

I expressed my own views on the situation as I see and feel fit. They are not for imposition on others, and they will not change.
It is a pity when posts end in a slanging match, which doesn’t bother me personally and I am quite happy to be shot down by Simon and any others.
The fact of the matter is that those aligned with my views for whatever reason, won the vote.
We are leaving and parliament needs to get together to get the best deal for the U.K. and to stop their petty infighting.

It is all speculation for the moment and the U.K. has always been used to fighting its corner on the world stage. Both the U.K. and the EU will get through it and trade will continue. Terms may change, but in the end it will mostly have all been a fight over views which may or may not be relevant.

I am quite enjoying it all!

Apologies if anybody dislikes my views,

3 Likes

UK%20Veto

https://fullfact.org/europe/eu-facts-behind-claims-uk-influence/

They won the vote but as the stakes are so high it is inconceivable that the losers shoul roll over and die.
I just heard a politician saying that Russia needs to get more involved with other countries to save her sovereignty. Isn’t the U.K. getting less involved with other countries to do exactly the same? I’ve never actually understood what sovereignty is and now I’m doubly confused.

2 Likes

Well done Simon, a fine piece of remoaner propaganda rubbish. Keep having referenda until you come back with the correct answer which suits the the EU!
Does free movement mean control of our borders?
How can anyone be sure that an extra 350 will not be spent on the NHS?
It is all speculation until the deal is announced.
At the end of the day, the Brit’s have decided to leave - let’s just try and make the most of it by fighting our corner together against the other side for an equitable result.
All the remoaner negativity just strengthens the EU and makes the U.K. position weaker.
I am British and want the best for the U.K. I choose to live in France because I like the French way of life. The more we approach a federal Europe, the less I feel certain about wanting to live here. France is losing its identity and attraction for me. My French wife feels the same. I prefer to stay in France, but if the rules did change (which they clearly won’t), then I would move.
I know that this is not possible for some people, but there are always economic choices to be made wherever one goes.

Brexit - here we come😊

5 Likes

Oh dear, the name calling has started again.

2 Likes

Indeed. But as you suggest referendums are about as democratic as a lynch mob. The while point about democracy is that you vote for a govt that you think will be best able to tackle the complex problems of the day and best represent your own views. The only reason for the referendum was to solve a little local difficulty/running sore in the Conservative Party.

5 Likes

I have never understood if people actually have clarity in their own heads, what they THINK sovereignty is. When in actual fact what they really mean and want to portray is something quite different.

I think the term has been used too freely and unrelated, by government / parliament officials ( MP’s etc) because they didn’t have a useful term for what they wanted to describe…and now they have set a precedent, and no one does actually know what they mean…they just throw the term around.
People then get caught up in it, having arguments with other people, about something that the “other” individual understands in a different way.

3 Likes

1 Like

Hardly surprising though

9 Likes

Excellent little video Simon. All totally true, let’s hope it gains traction.

3 Likes

Indeed.

If Brexit is so wonderful why should it be a fight?

Also I’m a little fed up with this “get together behind Brexit” meme. It’s almost as if the leave crowd isn’t quite certain of their convictions and wants everyone to agree that they were correct to bolster their confidence.

Finally, I’d like to think that there was freedom of thought and speech in the UK, even though we don’t have a formal constitution to defend them. Consequently no-one has the right to tell me to change my mind about something that I believe will be damaging to the country’s economy in the short and medium term (long term i.e. 20-30 years and beyond is anyone’s guess, in or out of the EU), has and continues to damage our standing in the world and which is largely built on fantasies of Empire.

If you read Nick Clegg’s book or Daniel Korski’s analysis of why the Stronger Together campaign lost the referendum it is clear that Cameron had legitimate reasons (beyond silencing the Conservative Eurosceptics) but the campaign itself was mendacious on the Leave side and inadequate on the Remain side - I’m happy enough to have a debate about our place in the EU and whether we should follow the path of closer integration or loosen our ties but I am not happy to accept that the referendum was actually about those issues and I am not happy to accept its result.

7 Likes

:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:

1 Like

Glenn,

The reason a extra 350M will not be spent on the NHS is because there is no 350M. It’s a made up number which, for example, doesn’t include the rebait the UK currently receives. This is just one interesting article on the lie. http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-latest-news-vote-leave-director-dominic-cummings-leave-eu-error-nhs-350-million-lie-bus-a7822386.html There are many others.

You say that “remoaner” negativity makes the UK position weaker. That can’t be true IMO because the UK has no bargaining power at all. This has been proved by the negotiations so far. May caved in to the three EU conditions in December while also caving in to a DUP driven fudge. She caved in on the rights for EU citizens during the transition period last week. Davis caved in to the 21 month transition this week and I hope he’s ready to do some major caving in on customs union, regulation and borders this Sunday or he might have to whistle (as Boris Johnson would say) for a transition deal in March.

If one really wants the best for the UK one has to ask, regardless of the referendum, what are the benefits of Brexit.? Just because people may have made a bad decision based on lies, misinformation and propaganda doesn’t mean they have to suffer the results for generations. There needs to be an open debate on what is the scope and what are the pros and cons, not “we voted for it and we have to have it even if it screws us”.

Despite searching long and hard I’ve heard no concrete, measurable benefits. When May was asked by Andrew Marr ten days ago what British industries would benefit she could only think of agriculture, which he pointed out to her is 0.7% of the UK economy. May’s March 2nd cherrypicking speech only served to highlight some of the many benefit of membership. https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/mar/02/theresa-may-brexit-speech-john-crace

I’d be interested to hear how you and your wife think France is loosing it’s identity.

5 Likes