So today I went to open a bank account at la Banque Postale. I took my passport, EDF bill, Insee registration, other bank details, RSI registration and last will and testament with me (yes I jest). Anyway I was a bit surprised to be asked for a titre de sejour as my passport alone was not good enough.
Only last week I opened another account and the above was accepted and account duly opened but a BP - er non. The lady pointed to the line which said residents francais ou residents dans pays europeenne ou assimiles* (monaco, lichtenstein, switzerland etc). The * meant that a titre de sejour was needed. I explained I thought that the asterisk only applied to the ou assimiles otherwise wouldn't residents francais also need one a titre de sejour?
Anyhow after being told the lady had passed many years in her metier, I explained that I believed strongly that as a European resident I did not need a titre de sejour and that my passport was sufficient - I did add my qualification as an accountant (but that was just me puffing up my chest to be honest in response to her...I've been in this trade many years comment - I know I shouldn't have reacted but I'm fed up with things that should be simple being so complicated at the moment). I just want an account into which I can put the proceeds from our house sale and be protected under the European law regarding banks solvency!
After consulting a colleague they then phoned the centre finance who confirmed yes a passport was all that was needed. Feathers were smoothed when we added all the details in setting up the account and discussed the children and the village we (both) live in.
The account was opened and I now have an appointment next month to apply for the Ecopret Taux 0 - about which the lady was very helpful and offered me lots of other products & savings accounts/loans etc.
I'm glad we managed to smooth things out but it just goes to show sometimes you do have to stand your ground especially if you are fairly sure you are in the right.
Now onto my next battle - dealing with the architect!
As our French bank manager told us, there is nothing free in France. You will pay for everything. (this was in response to our incredulity at paying for a debit card) in the UK I have credit and debit and dont pay for any of them.
I had a similar argument at the commissariat de police in Fontainebleau three weeks ago. I gave them my driving licence as proof of identity, and they wanted my passport. I told them that a passport is expensive and time-consuming to replace and therefore too risky to carry around all the time.
I was told that my UK identity card would suffice, but the police were incredulous when I explained that we didn't have ID cards.
The young policeman at the desk didn't appreciate my firm stand that we had come for an appointment, that no-one else would have known about the appointment and would be taking our place, that I'd provided my passport for the first interview, and that surely a French driving licence in the same name was sufficient. I also pointed out that we had previously been in to report an attack on my son as he waited at the school bus stop and that we had both provided our passports at that time. When I advised that if I had to do a 40km round trip to fetch my passport, he might like to explain to his superior why we were going to miss the appointment. It worked!
The whole ID thing for Europeans has to be sorted out. If we need some ID while in France, then surely it's up to the French government to provide it - free of charge!
One of my bugbears too.....though I have a different take on it. I am an organiser and a problem solver. When I shop, and sometimes, especially when we are entertaining or at Xmas when there could be 20 plus of us. I unpack the trolly quickly and efficiently because of the way I have packed the trolly. I have my bags ready and am packed by the time the last item is off the belt. My purse is out of my bag waiting to pay, always by debit card. I hold up nobody. My husband on the other hand...will buy 3 items, then starts hunting through his pockets to make the exact amount of change he needs. He can take minutes counting it out.
Ive also noticed in France there is a completely different attitude, whereby keeping people waiting isnt a problem, it isnt seen as being selfish, just normal. Everything coming off the belt before the customer packs the bag isnt unusual in my local supermarket in St Pardoux....then the tedious cheque. Again, I think in the UK we shop more like the Americans, speed is king as we all have jobs, kids to collect and a high speed life. I honestly find the fact that in the UK everyone pays by cards or cash really does reduce waiting times...oh, and of course the fact that for instance at my local Sainsburys there are 16 checkouts...usually at least 14 of them manned, on Saturdays all manned. In St Pardoux, a supermarket half the size of Sainsburys has 7 checkouts... and if there are 4 open it must indeed to a high day or holiday!
Carol, also stretching a long bow on the subject matter, but on people-watching and credit cards, so vaguely related? I am always surprised at how many people place great swags of stuff on the belts, go and pack them - so far so good since the days of packers vanished with the Dodo. But then embark (and sorry this will sound sexist but unavoidably so) will suddenly be aware that the cashier is waiting for the card to pay, which then means a massive search through the capacious handbags until the card is found. Almost as if the requirement is unexpected? It becomes doubly odd when the cashiers first ask for the Loyalty Card and that is usually ready and waiting?
As I say people-watching can be fascinating and frustrating.
I dont mind waiting in a queue....I am one of those people who doesnt fight with inevitability.....if there is a traffic jam....or a long queue in the shops....I tend to settle down for the long haul. I too am a people watcher, but prefer doing so in cafe's... I find the writing of cheques a tad tedious....seems some people can take a full 5 minutes....feels like stepping back in history!
Carol, the sooner the better as it drives me mad waiting for the procedures kicking in - possibly deliberately to discourage the method? However I do LOVE supermarket queues in many respects to watch human nature and relationships at work. I think I could write a book about what I see. Try it for yourself during those frustrating moments waiting - especially married couples, can be a real hoot!
I recently opened a current account with BP - passport and other usual paperwork was quite sufficient - we had other unrelated issues, that were a cause of our representative not doing her job correctly, so we were not without problems, but passport didn't create any (thank goodness)
Steve (Yates), I'm with you on this one even though my Carte expired about ten years ago, it is still useful on the odd occasion the passport is not enough. I have just renewed my British Passport for an exorbitant fee, and am also concerned about losing the thing - or having it nicked by someone.
I know the Carte d'Identité is different but that seems to be used daily in supermarkets where to my curious eye a large percentage of people still pay by cheque.
My mum and my sister have been living in Italy for over 20 years now, they both hold French passports but have to renew their resident permits each year.
The French architect that converted the barn my sister in law lived in certainly ignored all EU regulations, as did the bod who OK'd the building. This happened in the Languedoc. The apartments didnt conform to any bulding regs...despite this they were allowed to be sold and then all 6 apartment dwellers went on to spend 7 years, to date, and thousands of pounds to try and get compensation for living in apartments they cant sell, that are dangerous...and worse...they are responsible for any visitors who may injure themselves as the flats dont conform....now tell me how that happens? The case goes on and on....all parties...the Maire, the Architect have long since disappeared.
I know I'm with you x it's the same way that the French Architect manages to tell me that everything is different in France than for UK Architecture...err isn't it the same EC laws and regulations we adhere to? Ah yes - but that's why we love it here for the ability to adopt the EU rules where we want to and ignore the others just as easily. Its a wind up sometimes but we'll get there in the end. I did once work for a French Insurance Company - now that was interesting to get an insight into the way the company ran...very different to the UK insurers.
Carol - in the UK financial services sector in which I worked for many years - implementing numerous new banking and insurance regulations we gave regular training programmes to branch staff and head office, both in the form of CBTs (Computer based training) and formal presentation/update/refresher programmes. Oh and as project staff we also had to comply and do the training - which I have to say sometimes was not appreciated when I had a mountain of project work to do...but it was obligatory. No CBT passed = No contract.
Not being funny....but Im back in the UK....and about to start my second job (both for around 20 hours a week) and both are also short term...a few months...covering for sickness and longterm holiday breaks. Despite the fact I will only be doing said jobs for a short while...both require me to undertake training...2 full days training for one. The training will be repeated and updated every 6 months. Friends here in banks, councils, social services, housing associations are constantly being updated on new laws and EU regulations... doesn't that happen in France? we have had the same problems...being asked for paperwork which is A) unnecessary for EU citizens and B) is paperwork no longer used....
We have several insurance policies with Groupama for three years and they write to us several times a month with their special offer nonsense. We thought we would give them a chance with a deposit account. Although we went armed with EDF bill, telephone bill, passports etc., they were alarmed that our passports didn't have an address inside them. A move towards the door suddenly changed their minds. Attention! This method does not work with real fonctionaires.
One can pose the same question at twenty of these know-alls and still get twenty different answers.
If I have a card, especially such things as a long expired UN staff identity card, I carry them and without asking "would you like this?" dump the lot and as much paper documentation as my folder will carry on their desks. They make it hard for us, I make it harder for them, my simple solution. Usually works.
Our Marie give you a document which explains that they don't do Cartes de Sejours any more. Which has done the trick several times. I also keep in my bag an EDF bill of course.
Suzanne, your experience is typical of mine with French "authority" over many years. I just use the three strikes approach. I start out polite and friendly and if that doesn't work I move on to polite but firm and if that doesn't work I throw my toys out of the pram. It always works and even if I've had to go into "toys" mode we end up "friends". In fact the more "toys" the friendlier they get. My latest "toys" experience was when my local Sous Prefecture told me a UK car registration document wasn't a UK car registration document. I had to go to "toys" mode to get them to fax a copy to the grown-ups in Toulon who confirmed it was a UK car registration document. No apology from the local crew when they accepted my documentation but suddenly we were all best friends :-)