The simple answer is contained in Article 4 of the UK-France Double Taxation Convention
“© if he has an habitual abode in both Contracting States or in neither of them, he shall be deemed to be a resident only of the State of which he is a national;”
Hi Nigel, thanks for your thoughts. I think the points you make are valid and very likely correct. Unfortunately that’s not where I was at when I asked the original question yesterday. In other words I thought the Visa position was the simple answer. How wrong can I be!!
In reality my position is a little more complex than I’d painted initially…isn’t it always the way. Anyway, I’m retired from work due to a chronic health condition though not retired in the eyes of the state as I’m 60. That makes the health care side of things more complicated I think.
Regardless, I think there’s a lot of mileage in what you’ve said and I’ll certainly be looking into that all very closely, so thanks for your help.
You’ve all been so helpful, thank you very much for all the above.
In asking the question in the first place I wanted to ensure that things were legal and that I could be over there without fear of arrest or financial ruin (the latter as a result of potentially huge medical bills or fines by the authorities!).
I still think that a Visa would just allow us to be in France legally for its duration - full stop. So in exactly the same way as a visa to go to the USA just lets me in and, say, do touristy things for a defined period while there. It wouldn’t necessarily entitle me to anything else that a resident or citizen might get - paid for or otherwise.
My other key concerns then are tax implications and health care.
My fear was that I’d be deemed a resident of France for tax purposes after a period and that I’d have no health cover (I’d get the treatment if any were needed but I’d have to pay for it in full).
So I take from your thoughts that I would be deemed a resident for tax purposes as, simplistically, once there in France we will have to spend virtually all our time there since we’ll have rented out our UK house.
Going for a lie down now, far too complicated for me 
Even if not yet of UK state pension age one of the guarantees if you are covered by the Withdrawal Agreement is that when you reach state pension age you will be entitled to an S1.
You do not understand what I wrote. As I described it if you are tax resident in the UK as per the SRT then if you pay tax in the UK you cannot be taxed again on that same income in France. Certain income is always taxed in the country of origin eg rental income & government pensions but all other income will be taxed in the country of origin if you are tax resident there. As I explained in general if you are a Brit & divide your time between your home in France & your home in the UK then if you spend more than 90 days in the UK you will most likely be tax resident in the UK. Perhaps this flowchart explains it better?
Unless your financial affairs are very complicated it’s no big deal to be tax resident in France. Many people on modest incomes especially couples & especially pensioners find that they are better off tax-wise in France. In France you are taxed on household income so a husband & wife have two personal allowances which are counted together unlike the UK where each income & personal allowance is assessed separately.
Oh that it were that simple 
You may be taxed in the UK on Govt pensions but that is not the end of the matter. What you pay in tax in the UK is taken account of in France but if your income in total is sufficient to attract tax in France then you may find yourself paying the difference.
Thankfully the tax burden for UK pensioners in France is less than it would be in the UK (for us anyway) on our Govt pensions.
IIRC the situation was changed by Gordon Brown in the last (or last but one) Labour administration so its not so simple as just saying that it’s taxed in UK so the French fisc have no interest in it. You have to report your total worldwide income to the French fisc and they assess it according to their rules.
No that is not correct. If income is taxed in the UK it is never liable to taxation in France. However your UK income taxed in the UK is taken into account when assessing your personal allowance & what tax rate you should pay on any income taxed in France ie you don’t have two separate personal allowances keeping you below the tax threshold in both countries. You also are viewing this from the point of view of someone tax resident in France not as I have been describing where someone is resident in France thus declaring their worldwide income in France but tax resident & paying their tax in the UK.
Until Brexit is sorted and agreements finalised its a nearly impossible question to answer.
Visas come with conditions that normally define your tax position. I’ve been on plenty of 6+ month visas where at no point was I considered to be liable for tax - BUT I also had to have full medical insurance as a condition.
For now your best bet is read up on Visa for US/Aus people entering France/Schengen - thats where your best hints will come from.
The simplest way to view it … if you want benefits from the system you’re expected to contribute. You won’t get French State Medical Cover without paying tax/social charges. For 3-5 years that’d be “pushing” your luck on an EHIC card if you need regular medication/doctor appointments - or at the very least there’ll questions
Equally the we’re coming to live for 3-5 years suggests you’ll be French resident for that period - your renting your UK house - partner coming with you… most of the reasons to be viewed as remaining a UK tax resident are gone - equally float about the EU without a fixed base isn’t your plan - so all the usual reasons for remaining a UK tax resident are gone.
I am just an innocent French person living and paying her taxes in France, unversed in the ways of accountancy and international tax-fiddling but that sounds dodgy as anything to me.
Yes totally with you on all that Chris, thanks.
Really I guess where I was in my thinking (well, fears really).
That takes me back then to Nigel’s point that we should just make the move over before 2021. Of course, that’ll just bring the next batch of questions from me…standby everyone.
That is very much looking at it with English eyes. From the French perspective it is quite different, and it is only in complex cases where the two tax authorities can’t agree that it hinges on nationality. After 1/1/21 there are going to be hundreds of people in this position so I imagine that information will emerge.
It’s not dodgy at all it’s just the way the rules are applied. Le fisc have the equivalent of HMRC’s Statutory Residence Test that gets applied to French citizens splitting their time between the UK & France. Mostly the rules are to catch the wealthy who are ostensibly living in tax havens but in reality are living in million pound/euro properties in London or Paris. The tax needs to be paid somewhere & it would be unfair to tax people twice over so the UK-France Double Taxation Convention decides where the line is drawn to decide which country gets to collect the tax. It’s not something that the individual taxpayer has much control over other than by severely limiting their visits to their home country
I understand exactly what I wrote, the parts that you are disagreeing with. There are certain items that dual taxation agreement that have to be paid in one country not the other. If you have paid tax on those items in the ‘wrong’ country you still have to pay in the ‘right’ country and try to get a rebate from the first.
I have two home countries, I was born with them and have retained them. I have never had any trouble being quite clear about where I am domiciled employed resident and paying taxes.
If you only live in one country then your situation is simple as you tax residence & ordinary residence will be one & the same. If you live in two countries then it gets more complicated. In three countries even more so.
As per the UK-France Double Taxation Convention if you live between two countries & are citizen of one then you will be deemed to be tax resident in the one that of which you are citizen. If you are a citizen of both or of neither then le fisc & HMRC decide between themselves where you are fiscally resident.
Agreed. You could inadvertently pay tax on your UK government pension or UK property rental income in France & need to reclaim it. What other circumstance do you have in mind where tax is wrongly paid in both countries & you need to reclaim it from the one that should not have deducted tax?
Hello Jane,
If you find an answer do post it as this is going to become a common query next year😶
Came across this site which appears to be very useful if, like me, you are not yet legally resident in France and want to make the move pre or post 1.1.2021.
https://www.francerights.org/not-yet-resident-or-only-partly-resident-in-france.html
Except that would be a hard mistake to make.
Exactly ! Which is why I wondered what other circumstance you had in mind where tax could be paid in both countries on the same income & you would need to reclaim it from the one that should not have deducted tax?