Even before Covid Europe was going to change significantly due to Brexit. Now as a result of Covid most countries in the World are going to experience change on many levels. Will that change be for better or worse? For example, will inequality between the rich and the poor, nations as well as people, increase or reduce? What’s the role of major corporations and billionaire individuals in a new order? How can a democratic system which is now infiltrated by spin, social media and even potentially foreign bad actors and that results in people like Trump, Johnson and Bolsano getting elected be trusted anymore. It all looks a bit bleak to me
This quote is from the New York Times:
"The problem is that “our practice of capitalism is both putting the planetary ecosystem at risk and generating vast economic inequality.” The nation-state is “inadequate for managing transnational challenges like global warming.” And “representative democracy is neither truly representative nor very democratic as citizens feel that self-rule has given way to rule by corporations, special interests and the wealthy.”
So, basically things, a lot of important things, are broken. Is the current World leadership capable of envisioning a better future and working together to bring it about?
Winston Churchill:
"Many forms of Government have been tried, and will be tried in this world of sin and woe. No one pretends that democracy is perfect or all-wise. Indeed it has been said that democracy is the worst form of Government except for all those other forms that have been tried from time to time.…’
No - but leaders can be replaced by a determined peoples.
french revolution
68 student revolt (in germany we had a slogan - badly translated - under the gowns is the odour of a 1000 years)
green party rising
If we stay complacent - only moan a little - nothing will change. It does take a bit of doing by the populace to replace a leader or elect better ones.
But this only happens if we take a good look at ourselves and our desires first.
I think that a lot of this depends upon the young people.
If they think they have no future, what is there to stop them trying to change the status quo?
There’s a lot of talk about dismantling capitalism…
My own view is that capitalism itself is like any other thing; in that, the less it’s used, the less well it works.
My own hope is that consumerism slows down & that people are not so obsessed with having the latest model of “absolutely-any-fucking-thing”, simply because that’s what it is.
My view is that capitalism is like a vehicle. There are many kinds, with a variety of functions, but they all move under the direction of whoever sits in the driving seat: there’s your family hatchback; your school bus; your ambulance; your remote-control harvester that picks potatoes, washes them, peels them and slices them into chunks ready to be dropped into boiling oil, and sold in paper bags for up to 2 quid a pop, depending on the postcode.
Which kind of capitalism is the one the lucky voters in UK currently enjoy?
Isn’t that a bit base over apex ?
My own experience is that something which is unused remains capable of use when needed, but that something which is used a lot wears out and needs replacing.
The main problem for the future boils down to over population. Our problem as a species is that there are simply too many of us for survival in such numbers to be sustainable. As population increases so does the consumption of finite supplies of raw materials, and pollution that results in climate change also increases.
Either the Homo-Sapien species will find a way to reduce the rate of it’s own replication, or Mother Nature will do it for us by the traditional remedies of war, famine, plague, or pestilence.
There are too many of us, and that is why we have such things as Covid-19, immensely powerful storms reeking havoc in various parts of the world, floods with increasing frequency, and firestorms of immense destructive power.
The damage being caused by the sheer number of people in the world is immense, and is resulting in migrations that are only going to increase in size.
Ultimately there will be war as people fight to secure ever dwindling food supplies as an alternative to quietly starving to death.
So the future looks very bleak for mankind, but it is a future of our own making, and the way we are going at the moment I’m just glad that I probably won’t live long enough to see the ultimate ending.
Covid-19 has in a way shown us at least in part what we can do to stop the rot, but we need to be ruthless in order to succeed.
Relentless consumerism has to stop. Non essential travel has to remain stopped. Consumption of raw materials has to remain drastically reduced.
Basically the needs of the many have to outweigh the needs of the few and we have to learn to live in a sustainable way in every respect.
As a species we can change our ways, or we can just carry on regardless in the knowledge that Mother Nature (aided by the four horsemen of the apocalypse) will change them for us.
I’m not clever enough to give an in-depth answer.
My view on capitalism is that like any other mechanism, in that, lack of use leads to lower efficiency, (hopefully,) leading to an eventual overhaul.
Not very well explained, but obviously based on my experience of owning too many shit cars.
We have to be very very careful with the ‘it’s the population’ argument. The vast majority of environmental damage comes from wealthier people and wealthier countries. The danger here is that these most-damaging people and places will fix on the ‘it’s the population’ argument and demand sacrifices from others instead of changing their own economies and lifestyles.
I think this hits the nail on the head - although we use the term for shorthand, there is in reality no such thing as ‘capitalism’ - only capitalisms.
Throughout its history, capitalism has developed in many different forms in different legal, financial and cultural contexts. The frameworks within which it operates in, say, the USA and many western European countries, or the capitalism-communism hybrid that seems to be so economically successful in China, are entirely different - and this for me is the clue to making it work: since capitalism’s regulatory framework has always been changing, given the will we can change it again.
The problem is that the change required is profound - more profound perhaps than such past interregnums as the abolition of slavery or building of Europe’s welfare states after WW2. It is not just a matter of simple things like introducing green technologies. It has to deal with the core problem that capitalism tends to incentivise providing anything that can be sold for a profit, however damaging it may be environmentally or socially, and instead incentivise business behaviour that contributes to the well-being of people and planet.
I agree Geof and I believe (sadly) that these last months have not been brutal enough to instigate such a profound change. I would like to be proved wrong, but I think our world now is highly addictive (and there is so much that feeds that addiction, material goods, nutrition, technology, etc) and the drug addicts are going to be back in the crack den (and indeed demanding more, because they have been constrained through this brief period) in a matter of weeks.
There may be some changes but they will be superficial: better use of technology in the health service, (ultimately) much better understanding of viruses and how to “manage” them, fewer face to face meetings that require long distance travel in businesses, a shift to cleaner car technology, a minuscule number of people thinking twice about cruises, flying. A minuscule number changing working habits, starting cycling to work, put greater emphasis on quality of life, etc etc. For the vast majority it will be “business as usual”.
I HOPE (and it is a huge hope and not an expectation) that there is a complete overhaul of care for the elderly.
I HOPE (and it is a huge hope and not an expectation) that there is a greater emphasis on health / well-being / weight management / strong immune systems as being a way to combat pandemics and NOT “just” an emphasis on a medicalised solution.
For over twenty years “care of the elderly” has been privatised, run as a business for the profit of investors, at the expense of the old people, their families, and the people who provide the care ‘on the ground’.
The latter are mainly women and their work is physically and emotionally draining, calls for shift work including very unsocial hours including rotating night duty, cutting across the demands of family life and undermining health and morale.
People in social care are heavily involved in work that calls for a significant health-care input, including psychiatric care, for which only very rudimentary training is provided, and scarcely any time set aside to permit it.
Wages are abysmally low when viewed against the effort required to give even the very basic care, which usually also involves domestic duties as well as direct care e.g.all laundry work, domestic cleaning duties, preparing and cooking main meals and washing up. Carers are often required to do these tasks as well as giving hands-on care to frail and and poorly people.
The general public has scarcely any idea of the state of the elderly care “industry” as it has come to be called. It is a national disgrace, and the only thing that redeems it is the supreme commitment of the mainly women who try to hold it together, in the face of deliberate exploitation and neglect by successive governments, but mainly the Tories.
Will it be overhauled after Covid 19? No, emphatically, it will not. It never does. The same is true of institutional care of the mentally ill and most people with learning difficulty. Governments don’t care, because these services don’t win votes.
Absolutely right and it was always thus.
We are too absorbed with looking into the future and technology, which may well be of a help, not to look back and learn the lessons of history.
Whether you do or do not agree with Malthus’ religious views on the control of population, the fact remains that he was right.
And that is why I said HOPE (and not expect) Peter.
Interestingly in some languages - Portuguese for example - there are not two words for I hope and I expect. And yet in English they are so different.
You are absolutely right Sue and I noted your Hope was emphasised and your meaning clear and positive. My background in care doesn’t give me much hope for change in the sector, which has always been dreadfully underfunded, and the problems of the aged brushed under the carpet.
But I applaud your own commitment to change. With determined people like you change is more likely to be achieved
Indeed. ‘Esperar’ is the Spanish for not only to hope/expect but to wait. So we hope, we may even expect but sadly we will also wait … till mañana
They are indeed the ones who will inherit the earth.
The problem lies not only with the ones who think they have no future - and the circumstances of those young people may well justify that thought.
But also the middle class air-heads who, like my god-daughter, have been thru’ tertiary education at SOAS, got a 2.2 in a useless subject in which she had no interest, [because now ‘All Shall Have Prizes’], and settled down to a life of comfortable consumption.
On a recent exchange of emails I sent her a snip of Hitler and Franco strutting along a line of troops on the platform at Hendaye, giving the NAZI salute, juxtaposed with a snip of a large group of people standing on the forecourt of Franco’s mausaleum at the Valley of The Fallen, giving the NAZI salute. Most of these people were born since Franco’s death. The Spanish Civil War is not yet over.
My point was that freedom is hard won and one should be ever vigilant.
I got a reply that has so incensed me I cannot face pulling it out of ‘the bin’ to re-read it. In short, this 30-something said she had no interest whatsoever in politics, that my letter was all the politics she wanted for 2020, that none of it had anything to do with her …
Another group may have their hearts in the right place and the best of intentions but when presented with
the wagons circle and surviving the obligations and exigencies of family life becomes paramount.
It always intrigues me that living in France subscribers still take an energetic interest in the UK. I suggest that there two issues.
First, there are criticizers “too little, too late”. Never we would have done this, that, the other. Are the critics practising sloping their shoulders, denying responsibility, Grenfell fashion? Generally, the UK public are following guidelines. At a two metre distance you can hear conversations. If they moan, they moan about the critics. They would rather celebrate contributions. The Thursday 20:00 NHS celebration is typically “British”. The “twice round the block queues” have all but disappeared as the public have adapted to the pandemic.
Of course there will be a time to learn. How will Sweden think in a years time. Every death is sad, inevitable, but still distressing. What will the year on year fatalities show? Will it be possible to tease out fatalities accelerated by cancer or heart disease? The NHS are encouraging the population not to “nobly” ignore none covid symptoms. But, I suggest, it is still appropriate to comply with the guidelines. It is not the time for the gilet jaune. It is the time as this theme has identified for the populace to “debate” what the future might bring. And, whilst not SHOUTING they do need to be active in that debate. Social distance prevents: in the pub, basking in the sun outside a cafe. But, surely that is a opportunity. Anthony’s rhetoric is hushened. Instead their can be a quiet, but assertive hum of conversation amongst the populace. Let all have ears for each other, rather than the spin doctors. Celebrate your own values, rather than strive to join “the cool”. Remember Groucho Marx,
And that, identifies the other issue, how do you get that collective voice peacefully heard when it goes counter to that complicit servitude that our leaders elected/non-elected have “trained” us in a Pavlovian manner to exhibit. I suggest live media, for example, radio phone-ins are the entré. Our politicians can assert that they are engulfed with emails (They are of course, working from home, so have more time to read and repy - but they do’nt, they just wait for the regular refuse collection.) If you get cut off on the radio then that is an active action.
Will the wealth gap increase? I suspect the answer will be yes. Commerce’s objective will be to restore their revenue flow, and improve their ranking in the market place. The cost of living in France and Italy is higher than Spain and the UK. Who expects food cost to go down in France. Subscribers who have identified consumerism as a driver are right. But, for example, do those who are trying to give up smoking need to vape? In the UK the players of the top clubs have agreed to a temporary 20% reduction in their club remuneration package. But who ultimately pays “entertainers” , media celebtities - the Jeremy Clarksons, sports persons. We do. But, is "self-entertainment an opportunity in waiting? It can be better than your eight year old reading outloud Balzac or Dickins. But society has not always had mobile phones and in-house cinema.
One final thought. we all need the economy: global, national, local to recover. But, this thread suggests that in the rush prior to the pandemic we lost sight of “citizenship” - or dare I say it, “Liberté, égalité, fraternité”. Another big question is how do we enable, empower ourselves to collectively deliver those values.
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