I think it is both derogatory and accepting Celeste. Patricius was not Irish, but when he was the missionary/bishop of Armagh he became Qatrikias in the old form of Gaeilge that gradually became the Cothraige (early modern Gaelic) Pátraic, thenthe 'modern' form Pádraig took over. Before Dafydd was saint of all Wales, some considered Padric their patron saint. Anyway, the Pad version took hold and the Pat form found its way into English from Latin via the Germanic and Norman influences. In Europe name variance, such as Dick for Richard in English, were a legacy of the Romans who shortened names. For instance we know Publius Ovidius Naso as Ovid or Servius Sulpicius Galba Caesar Augustus who took over from Nero but is best known simply as Galba. We Scots have Jock that is John, Jack, James or Jacob depending on the sources, Deoch is the Gàidhlig, deriving from Gaelic/Old Irish Deog meaning drinker. That is drogatory. The modern variant is calling every man Jimmy, but also both demeaning and recognising although a very strange way of doing it. Old forms of Pat and Pati for men appear in medieval writings, so I would assume the same happened to Patricius.
So, I think it has been around for centuries and became derogatory when the animosity between England and Ireland mounted much as Fritz is short for Friedrich for the Anglosaxon world and Fridolin for the Francophone. although both are less used now. Friedrich II of Prussia was 'der alte Fritz' champion of enlightenment whose influence was feared and hated by predominantly Catholic France and Anglo-catholic England.
So Paddy, depending on how it is used goes both ways. Having always had a lot to do with Irish folk (my sister has been married to two of them) and show me a red haired woman from SW Ireland with green eyes and my knees turn to jelly, I see it both ways. Tak if frae me, thaurs a few o' yin fowk that ca' me Jimmy and I dinnae care frae tha'.
I really don't see what colour has got to do with it. Most expatriate Brits, whatever colour, think of themselves as 'expats', whilst the local community probably think of us as immigrants. Hence we are both expats and immigrants.
I'm a foreigner and an immigrant here in France, whether or not I decide to stay here for life. And yes, to the French, we are all foreigners and immigrants, and they are right. Interestingly, I have acquaintances from the UK who call themselves ex-pats, and reserve the terms 'immigrants' and 'foreigners' for others, even if they have been here full time for 20 years and have not been sent here on a temporary posting. The terms are certainly more loaded in English, as someone in this forum pointed out. For me, the term 'ex-pat' is a comical one; it conjures up visions of Monty Pythonesque mustachioed men in pith helmets, having cocktails by the pool and grumbling about everything that's wrong with the natives.I get the impression that some people are afraid they will lose their culture if they call themselves an immigrant or a foreigner, whereas if they call themselves an ex-pat, it's like saying, "I'm just living in a different part of the European Union, it's purely geographical, but don't think for a moment that I am going to acquire or appreciate any of your peculiar habits; I'm only here for the weather." I know where I come from, but funnily enough I have become a foreigner when I go back to where I came from. And I've noticed that the longer I stay in France, the more I realize that I will never actually be French. I just go along with it, trying to fit in, while privately grumbling about what's wrong with everyone around me :-)
I think we’ve quietly adopted the Paddy term not unlike the blacks started using the word nigger in their own society, and it is not deemed derogative anymore.
We even call St Patrick’s Day, Paddys Day (but not Pattys Day, that’s downright insulting).
I am proud to be a Paddy because of where it comes from, those emigrants worked hard and created new societies that we enjoy today. Despite racism, we are loved all over the world too.
I am celebrating today with about as much Irishness as I can muster. I’m going skiing smothered in a cold, may be my last chance this season. would I rather be standing on the streets of Cork City waiting for the parade in sleet and rain? Em, no
We use the term 'travailleur expatrié' and the verbe expatrier for sending people abroad/for people who are sent here from abroad for work. It just means your tax status is different ;-)
People coming to live here, or moving to another country, with the intention of staying are 'immigrés', whether they need a visa or not. They have left their 'home' country & gone to live permanently in another one, it is as simple as that. I think the term simply isn't as loaded as it seems to be in English.
I see this as being slightly off the ball. Non-white migrants from the UK and other Anglophone countries are also called expats. One of the Guardian pick comments actually says that. What the fine line between immigrant and expatriate actually is remains unclear to me. However, it would appear that the assumption is that the expat retains close contact with his/her 'home', to a greater extent retains customs and habits and often an uncompromising preference for their language to the point of barely learning that of their host country. I am not sure that is not actually a stereotype but they do exist. I am not able to be like that.
I have been bilingual all of my life. It is a bit schizophrenic when one acknowledges that living in two worlds with access to both as though truly native means a different personality emerges with the language being used. However, it makes adaptability so much easier. When I went off to South America more on a whim rather than as something properly planned out, I spent three months in the language laboratory three, four or five days a week and between two and four hours a session learning Spanish. I got to South America and the Spanish was different to what I had learned. I went at the same time as two other students, neither of whom had learned more than French at school and gone to the language laboratory too. We occasionally met by chance. Because I had languages rather than one I was able to adapt and modify my Castellano far more easily than they could. What I learned was that I had a mechanism in me somewhere that told me there is not only one way of being. So I have never felt attached to somewhere.
I am entirely proud of my Scots origins and keep a kind of tenuous contact with family and friends there. However, I am most likely to say I am a European simply because I will concede my origins are on this continent rather than another. I have done a lot of travelling and spending time in other countries. Some I love, but I do not feel part of them. I could easily live in a handful of them. I have at the same time rarely felt as self-conscious and alien as some people do. We have a few English folk nearby, the only Scot went home last autumn, but I do not actually socialise with any of them although I like a couple a lot. My social life is with my Italophone life partner and my now French speaking children, the three of them generally prefer French now so why should I impose in France with French speakers and impose English on them? My wife and I work together using mainly English, she only gets to use her own language occasionally. But then I only usually use one of my two.
So, I think the line about only white people are expats is incorrect to begin with. I also know the word as used in English does not per se exist in other languages or if it does is not used the same way. I also believe that when I sit to eat, lay down to sleep and so on is where I belong at that point in time and do not miss where I 'came from'. Sum ergo, I am now an immigrant into France which is on the mainland of Europe where I feel at one with the world. I figure I do not fit the bill, therefore I am not an expat.
As far as I'm concerned, anyone coming here & intending to stay, wherever they come from, is an immigrant. Anyone on a say, 2 or 3 or 5 year posting or secondment, not intending to stay forever is an expat, wherever thay come from.
I have noticed that British people don't like the term immigré (that's the one I use) being applied to them & suspect it is because it puts them in the same basket as Poles/Moroccans/Malians & other groups these same British people are frequently scathing about...but as far as French people are concerned you are all the same.
Good article. I do call myself an immigrant, because I feel like one. I am living in a foreign culture and speaking a second language. I am an immigrant. I describe myself as an immigrant when talking to other people about myself.
But, strangely; I tend to call other Britishers here "ex-pats". It seems to feel more respectful somehow and now I see why.
I do meet British "ex-pats" immigrants , occasionally, sadly, here in France, who do not like "immigrants"expats in the UK, & are profoundly racist towards them - although I have to say they do not appear to distinguish much, any more, between black & white immigrants,expats, because they include Polish & other eastern white Europeans in their version of the despised category of 'immigrants'. They describe French as 'racist', when they don't speak, or don't want to, speak English. They usually return home or emigrate somewhere new after a few years. I feel sorry for them because they have few friends.
I'm certain I have unconsiously distinguished white 'expats' from black 'immigrants' and I shall make more of an effort to even things out in future....I don't like banning words, so I reckon I am going to deliberately call white people immigrants and black ones ex-pats for a while! and if you're mixed race I expect I may have to call you an 'immipat' oh bugger, now what?
Having lived and worked in different countries, and travelling a lot, I simply consider myself "a woman of the world".
Having said that, I feel Irish in my blood and will always relate easily to the country I was born and raised. Good and bad.
I think everyone has their own take on both terms mentioned in the article, and it create a great debate. But there is also the media coverage and how the terms are used politically and legally that influences our opinions and beliefs.
My German husband moved to Ireland in the 80s. He had an "alien' card to allow him to live in a foreign country. I know we didn't have the EU back then, but we did have the feckin EEC. And seeing that most of our 'assistance' money was coming from Germany, wasn't it a bit disrespectful to legally brand him an alien?
Perhaps we should have labelled him 'benefactor' :-)
I think it depends on your life in your new country, I feel far more an immigrant than an expat. My whole life is here, my OH and kids are French, I work, live and play in French 99% of the time (1% = sfn!). Interested to see what others think/how they feel...?!
