It tells you how much houses have sold for over the last couple of years, along with which parcels of land were included in the sale.
If you can find a finished house of similar character/size/location then deduct your renovation costs, this then gives you a target offer price.
I would be very cautious undertaking major renovations as it is very expensive - ideally find something either complete or nearly complete. It is fairly apparent from house prices that renovations are not particularly financially viable as you can buy complete houses for less than the price of a “doer upper” + renovation costs.
Sound advice because if you calculate the cost of renovation + the stress of trying to find material /professionals as needed then I do believe its better to ‘up the ante’. Better to go for something that although may appear to be ‘over your budget’ will ultimetly end up costing less in the long run…
Unless of course that’s part of the idea. We thoroughly enjoyed the renovation - although some bits only in retrospective! All the houses we’ve lived in we tinkered with, so it was fun to start from scratch. We made friends doing it, got to know all sorts of people locally and generally was a positive experience. Financially of course it was rubbish! In total our gîte cost us 150,000€ (135m2) and we could probably sell it for around 120,000€. But it’s exactly as we want it, and earns us more than had we put money in bank so we are happy with the decision.
You can also get similar information once you are in your espace particular in impots.gouv, and which has the advantage of being able to sort/search - so can sift the info quickly to get characteristics you want. However not much use for a non-resident! Your one is more useful for this particular query!
It isn’t really an investment here. My house has been on the market, and I factored in to the asking price the value that I have already enjoyed from the house - ie. how much rent l would have had to pay for all the years I’ve inhabited it. Subtracted that, and l arrived at the
price the immobilier recommended.
I am getting a lot of comments that your French houses aren’t investments and that you don’t expect to make profit when you sell et al. I am not sure this suggestion is safe. Surely many factors exist that denote if your property appreciates in value. If you believe the reports that France is having a property boom currently. Sure if you bought s huge ruin in the middle of nowhere and built to a luxury spec, then I get it. You may not get back what you put in. But, if you buy low and keep an iron hand on renovation costs, I don’t see why it can’t reward financially. Especially if the area is popular, the village is growing and the transport links are frequent.
Isn’t this just being a canny operator…or have I forgotten this totally wrong?
Sure you might be able to turn a profit, but I think we are just all saying do not look at the situation from a british perspective. Even in the periods when the French market has boomed…in comparison to the UK the boom is usually no more than a quiet ‘pop’. So if is far better to have low expectations and be pleasantly surprised when the time comes. And renovation costs are high! If you keep to 1,000€ a sq m for redoing a shell I’ll send you a bottle of something sparkly…
Property developers do exist, and they do make a profit. But it’s a hard slog to do so, and you probably need to work with an experienced team to keep costs controlled.
This graph might help explain why a lot of people on SF will tell you that one should be very careful about regarding French property as an investment.
Historically French property prices were static basically for ever - 1960’s through 2000 (black line on the graph), there was then a boom but since the global recession starting 2008/9 prices are static again (after some wobbling).
High estate agent’s & notaire’s fees mean you have to make 10-15% just to break even and when you do come to sell you have to consider who is going to be your buyer - rural properties renovated in a British style may well appeal largely to fellow Brits and the effect of Brexit has very much been to slow down the desire of Brits to buy in Europe.
All of this can change, obviously, there are also vast differences between rural and urban price movements and as Jane says property developers do exist in France and manage to make a profit - but it’s harder than in the UK where there has been strong upward growth on property prices, especially in the South fairly consistently over the last 40 years.
Welcome to the club! - don’t forget that whatever the rational arguments for or against, everyone here has weighed the options, looked at the numbers and thought fuck it we love France we’re doing it anyway
Darren, welcome, and here’s my advice for what it is worth - get trawling on the web!
‘Cheap French Properties’ is a good start (type it in your search box) Also GreenAcres is a site where Owners put their properties on the market - granted at usually optimistic prices, but at least it takes out the Agency euation - at least initially.
Just for the record I did this on three properties in France which I finally bought.
One thing you might be surprised at is how low an offer can be particularly on an empty property - which diminishes in value and quality rapidly. Granges are in plentiful supply all over France. NB the resale price and taxation applicable if you want to sell before five years ownership. Also renovation prices can be a killer, and there is no rule of thumb I know of that applies. Very often local services - brickies, plumbers, etc., etc; can be in short supply - and expensive.
I am prejudiced because I am useless at anything practical, so always buy in services. IF you do work yourself, then so much the better BUT remember your own work does not count against any tax applicable (you cannot invoice yourself!)
Personally I would be looking at a property to ‘update and/or refresh’ than a complete rebuild of a Grange.
You can put a personalised entry on French Property News - which is English language, and they have a form you can fill out as to where, number of bedrooms, how much land etc., etc and your budget range.
It IS a site for Agencies, which then provides a contact for more details if required (extra photos etc); There are others of the same type. You could be pleasantly surprised at what you find.
If you are turning a barn into a house, ie there was nothing, then count 1000 to 1500 € per m2 for the cost of renovation. This is just a basic rule of thumb and depends on materials etc. Obviously you can spend a lot more quite easily.
Not forgetting of course that permission must be had for conversion. Also a building that has never been connected to electricity will have to be inspected by EDF for their approval once electrical work has been carried out. Without being to normes then you won’t get your supply.
I’m quite local. You’ll possibly have a 20% TVA as it sounds like a conversion rather than a renovation. You might need an architect if over 150m2 of floor area is created. Just things to verify that will affect your budget quite dramatically. Hope you like the grange.
TVA is the French version of UK-VAT. “Taxe sur la Valeur Ajoutée”
It is payable on all work done (if that Enterprise/Artisan is registered for TVA.)
Depending on the age of the property and the kind of work being undertaken - one can sometimes be charged a reduced rate of TVA - which can make quite a difference to the final Bill.
