Try calling first thing in the morning as soon as the lines open.
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Just reporting back! Took a while getting past the poor lassie who took the call but when I finally got to a âtechnicianâ they made complete sense, told me to ignore the letter and fill in the FFI for this source of income. Iâm not thrilled of course since getting one of those certified by our local tax office is by no means easy, but it is at least consistent with my previous experience.
Good luck. Let us know how you get on with your local tax office.
I couldnât face mine and just reinvested my personal pension.
Iâd been doing that for years and then decided it was about time to take it - but it wouldnât give me an annuity as it did originally before âtheyâ sold it on and I couldnât transfer it anywhere else because I was not UK resident, so I was stu**edâŚ
Iâll let you know how it goes 
I just called in at the St Lo tax office (I was going to ths prĂŠfecture anyway to puck up the new CdS) without a rdv, was seen within 5 minutes and came away with a nice stamp and signature on the FFI
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Thatâs worth knowing, @Mark . I always found the St Lo tax office to be absolutely brilliant but was told I had to deal with the (unutterably useless) Avranches one now. Theyâre the ones the direct messages end up with.
Since I have a stupid tendency to do what Iâve been told, I havenât been back to St Lo but after your experience I definitely will! They are sooo helpfulâŚ
My TF bill got sent from Avranches to my old address in the Creuse this year. Not been to see them yet, but I sent a messageđĄ
Angela, of course you should be thrilled at the wonderful tax treatment the French Republic gives to our pension pots which the UK have donated 20% (or 40% or 45% if you were a higher rate taxpayer) and the Republic are happy to tax at a mere rate of 6.75%
France, a tax haven? Jamais!
Totally understand of course you are referring to the paperasse as your turnoff but thatâs the price 
Yep, Iâll log in again in a yearâŚ
Glad you got the right answer in the end from HMRC.
Hopefully to help anyone going forward, I canât offhand think of any common scenario whereby a French resident in receipt of any (non government type) UK pension, wanting either a tax refund and/or NT code, wouldnât need an FFI.
The technical reason is that the FFI is the formal tax treaty claim to exempt the UK sourced pension from UK tax. The unhelpful earlier response from HMRC rejecting your original claim could have helpfully pointed out the appropriate route (ie an FFI) to obtain a refund in an international contextâŚ
Do keep us in the loop about any success or otherwise with the various ImpĂ´ts at St Lo/AvranchesâŚand good luck!!
Hi @George1 Iâve recently had a client come back to me that is doing a full withdrawal.
HMRC have said that they canât issue the NT code as they havenât made any withdrawals.
Worryingly they said just take a small amount out and then send the form in and they will have a tax code for the pension and they can update it.
Massive problem being here that of course that would mean it would be outside the scope for the low tax rate in France as the whole pension isnât paid as one lump sum.
Still waiting to hear back on the progress of this⌠but are you aware of not being able to issue an NT if the pension isnât in payment?
Itâs the crux of the problem Dave - always emergency tax applied! Then HMRC allocates a tax code. And wonât refund until the DTT form received (and processed). Your client can though possibly at least send in the form before the withdrawal - my Impot stamped my form with just the name of the pension provider and plan numbers filled in.
But did you see Karen Lotâs post and my response in the other thread?
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Sorry for butting in and Iâm sure George will reply but donât you have to withdraw the full amount first, then HMRC levies the emergency tax, then you get your local French tax office to stamp the form, you send it to HMRC and they refund the emergency tax?
I didnât realise you could ask HMRC to apply a NT code in advance, ie before youâve cashed in the pension.
Just noticed Larkswood pipped me to the post!
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Hi Dave. I can only wish that HMRC would do âadvance clearancesâ for many types of transactions involving individuals. I suspect their unwillingness to do so is partly a lack of trust in taxpayers, a lack of prioritisation of the issue, and probably insufficient staffing resources to manage a pipeline of approvals.
In particular they will not (to the best of my knowledge) anticipate future pensions withdrawal(s) by issuing an advance NT code. They want to see the full residence details and the proof of tax being withheld, then (in the absence of being chased) no doubt put the FFI in in a long backlog queue, eventually study it, and only then, in their munificence, generously release the refund.
I agree with larkswood12 that you could send in an FFI in advance but Iâm not sure it would accelerate the process materially, until there has been an actual withdrawal, by which time of course, as he and Helenochka have said, itâs too late. Emergency tax has been withheld. Frustratingly, NT codes just donât work for taxpayers with 100% lump sums.
Does your client have the financial resources to bear the consequences of following the simplest, most effective step of all? Take the entire lump sum to benefit from the 6.75% French tax treatment, suffer the emergency tax in the UK, follow the steps set out in the guidance at the top of this thread, and with a fair wind, will have the refund from the UK within about 2-3 months. It is purely cash flow, hence the question about the clientâs resources (you donât have to answer!).
The tax refund return is 100% of course, and the French 6.75% tax presumably wonât be due for many months, ie long after any UK refund received. Of course HMRC may subject a particularly large refund to enhanced scrutiny but that would happen anyway. HMRC told me that refunds of up to ÂŁ250,000 (!) are not normally subject to enhanced checks.
Hope this helps. Also hope to catch up with you at the SF Northerners gathering next month!
Dave, an afterthought⌠Larkswood12 has referred to the parallel thread discussion (âUK pension problemâŚâ) on this issue. In particular we have discussed there whether there is any benefit in approaching the ImpĂ´ts for an advance ruling (a ârescritâ) on taking a nominal pensions withdrawal to trigger a PAYE emergency code, followed by a full withdrawal once an NT or normal code is issued and if that prejudices the French 6.75% treatment.
While there is no harm or cost in so doing, the more I think about it, the less likely it seems the Impots would agree. You may recall seeing my detailed report a while back when I made a rescrit asking about taking two lump sums from a UK plan, one in France as resident, one in the UK prior to becoming resident in France.
To cut a long story short, the ImpĂ´ts would only really accept this if the first withdrawal was (paraphrasing - they donât use these words) a âhardshipâ withdrawal eg (from memory) following events like bankruptcy, divorce, death of spouse etc. Enabling soon to be wealthy UK pensioners to benefit from a few months of cash flow, with absolutely no loss of tax overall is probably not what the framers of legislation had in mind with the concept of hardship!
In that case would you not just split the pot into 2 pots? 1 to be taken in UK the other after residence changes to France
Thatâs exactly the process Iâm in the middle of!
The extra thing you have to watch, which wonât apply to the situation @Dave_Lawson is describing, is that HMRC have a nasty tendency to reset the pensions you already have an NT against when a new pension withdrawal happens. In that case, you can make sure that itâs set back to NT for the original pensions by ringing up - theyâll do that while you are on the phone.
For the single or first new pension withdrawal you have to put up with them swiping a sizeable amount of emegency tax (in my case calculated by taking my other pensions into account as well) and then using the FFI to get the money backâŚeventuallyâŚ
Iâm sure youâll get there in the end Angela.
Iâve no idea how the Strasbourg office would react to being asked to stamp the form because I wimped out of asking them.
Thatâs part of the reason this is all taking so longâŚI get so stressed over this kind of thing 
Me too. This is why I want to marry George.
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I think there may be a queueâŚ
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