I have to say some of these comments are truly hilarious, not sure if it’s intentional or delusional. Hey ho.
And some are downright nasty but we all make our choice on who we want to be.
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Were (are) you on the frontline Gus? It must be frustrating and freeloading is wrong. I have seen some cases, there was an old joke about the guys drinking in their local and a pal comes in and one says “here’s Johnny, better buy him a drink, he’s working”. However I’ve never seen the stats that prove the problem is as big as claimed (no pun intended). I’m happy to be convinced, but whenever I’ve scratched the surface I’ve discovered the checks and balances are pretty good on social security fraud. I’ve come to the conclusion it’s just another attempt by failing politicians at deflection and scapegoating.
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Go on then, which?
Be ready with evidence, not just anecdote, to back up your claims.
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I have to say that some comments on this thread disgust me…
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Bollox 
you’ve fallen for the lie. Would you want to live on the dole?
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Ah, but people believe that which supports their views.
Some and probably an increasing number of people do, and of course social media facilitates that. But many others a more analytical.
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I think there are two prevalent views exhibited here, both of which are - in my opinion - wrong.
One is the view that being unemployed and in receipt of benefits when you are capable of work is a lifestyle choice.
The other is that unemployed people are victims of an unjust system.
The truth is much more complex than that. Those (few, I suspect) of us who know, and have friends who are, long-term unemployed will be aware that neither punishment nor unconditional benefits are helpful to those we want to help.
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Very mean spirited, why not? I expect she pays taxes like everyone else and has produced someone who’ll be contributing to pensions etc.
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Well for me the two issues are that I believe there is a robust system to prevent fraude and that politicians of a certain flavour gaslight voters to believe that is not the case. The idea being that welfare recipients, which but for the grace of God (as they say ) we could all become, are wasting tax payers money, not the incompetents in power.
It’s the old wealthy Tories want no tax and no welfare, and the ragged trousered class want the opposite. What Britain lacks is a sensible middle ground party.
I agree with your final analysis, that the world is complex and each individual might need sanction or encouragement depending on multiple factors.
I think it is also the case that being unemployed is very far from being a “lifestyle choice” in today’s world and have provided examples of the arbitrary and frequently callous way that the DWP treats people - no one would choose that sort of abuse.
Are unemployed people victims of an unjust system?
Here I don’t share your stated view, though I agree that the situation is complex. Many people, unable to work because of circumstances outside their control, do find the system unjust in practice and “policy announcements” like Hunt’s can do little to dispel that view.
I’m not sure about the first part of your comment - the system to prevent fraud seems overzealous and treats all claimants as dishonest when the truth is that it is a tiny minority.
Certainly the second half is true though - the government would happily have you believe that fraud exists at a much higher level than reality as part of demonising the unemployed.
Which lie?
It is certainly true that the government reports 8.6 million people who are neither in work or looking for work in its latest figures
The “living on the backs of workers” claim is more interesting and goes into what activities we value in society and how economic activity enriches us all - certainly there would be more benefit into putting a couple of hundred £ into the pockets of the unemployed who will spend the money and stimulate the economy than providing inheritance tax cuts that will benefit a few thousand (at best) in all likelihood already well off individuals as they inherit their parents’ estates. Money which they do not need to and will not spend in the wider economy.
As for your final question - no I would not wish to live solely on benefits and I can’t imagine that many who do want to either.
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Depends what one means by robust. I didn’t mean fair🙁
Quite
It seems obvious that fairness was not one of its design goals.
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The lie is it’s (define “it” as you please) all the fault of the lazy work dodging spongers. Another lie is that despite not being able to do SFA regarding the army of immigrants needed to keep the lights on (and the potatoes picked) we’ll make a big show of attacking the small number of asylum seekers to keep the Alf Garnetts in the Tory faithful happy.
It’s all so formulaic and repetitive it’s a bore, but with a stupid electorate it seems to suffice. I mean, if “let’s get (an oven ready) Brexit done” worked, who knows what bunch of carefully constructed lies might get the Tories over the line again.
Especially with Starmer supporting genocide in Gaza. The only thing he’s firmly in favour of is, it would appear, a spot of ethnic cleansing. If I manage to get my vote back under the new “Brit abroad” legislation I’ll vote LibDem, even if it is a wasted vote (though the Monster Raving Loony party is another option).
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Ah that one. Indeed, that is certainly one of the lies the Tories want you to swallow hook line and sinker - the way you quoted @Annej2003 I thought you were going to claim the 8.6 million was false.
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There is a basic misconception regarding the taxes we pay and the ‘rights’ we have to decide how and where these are spent by the elected government.
Once paid, an obligation required for citizenship, the individual’s taxes become funds for the collective. All have a right to voice their opinions but no empirical right to decide how the taxes are used, having democratically elected (in theory) and ceded control to that government, who then decides and allocates the funds. Theoretically, with trust on our behalf and occasionally after open consultation. Illustratively, paying larger amounts of tax, due to greater wealth or income does not give a person a greater voice in how the monies paid should be used. Nor is the amount of tax a person pays in UK related to their lifetime of free healthcare services.
Perhaps those who shout about what “my taxes” are being used for, should pause to remember that the measure of a society is how it treats its weakest members.
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Please don’t do that John.
Until the UK gets a proper voting system we are tied to the demographics of the constituency where we have a vote i.e. we all need to vote tactically to maximise the defeat of the ship of fools that have been wrecking things since 2010.
I know that you know all this but I never like to see advocation of vote wasting.
A vote is an expression of your wishes.
It is never wasted.
We voted Green last year in Stroud due to the tactical voting between th e Lib Dems and the Greens.
We ended up with a Tory, mainly due to boundary changes which now make a huge housing estate on the outskirts of Gloucester part of Stroud constituency.
Not voting is a wasted vote, even though it might feel like spitting in the wind.
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Just a couple of points:
Firstly, we seem to be getting huge amount of posts on this forum about British politics, and this is after all a forum about France! If you guys want to discuss British politics, it’s no problem to me, go ahead, I don’t have to read it. But I would say discussing French or world politics is more relevant to this forum.
Secondly, I understand that things aren’t going too good in the UK in recent years (I am British too, but no longer follow British politics any more as I’m resident in France), but I wonder how much of your hatred towards the current government is similar to the hatred I see around me towards Macron. Hatred that usually develops when the same government has been in power for quite a long time (possibly too long). Feel free to comment on that, but I won’t be saying more on the subject as I’m not well enough informed.
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