You obviously missed my post earlier the the thread Maureen. No organisation that loses its charitable status can keep control of its charitable assets: they (or the funds for them) were donated, bequeathed, etc, for charitable purposes and under very favourable tax etc conditions: charity assets are NOT privately owned but held in trust for charitable purposes, so if an organisation loses its charitable status the assets have to go to the state or to another bona fide charity (but still under the supervision of the state).
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You make an excellent point very well despite your âpoorâ education: well done!
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Yes, he will just appropriate it all. Disgraceful.
You might say the same about the appropriation of publicly owned railways and rolling stock, water resources, electricity generating and distribution plant etc etc by Tory governments to line the pockets of currency vultures.
In the selfsame way, it seems, that Boris has already pledged the whole UK economy to hedge-fund speculators by guaranteeing them a crash-out Brexit?
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We now have the actual policy on this - published today in the Labour manifesto.
As I noted early in this thread there is not (and never was) any intention to âabolishâ private schools: the commitment is to ask the social justice commission to advise the Labour government on integrating private schools into the state sector, and closing tax loopholes for elite (ie. very high fee) schools.
I expect (and hope) this will come up with something much more like the French system outlined earlier in the thread: private schools, enabling different educational philosophies, but very close to the state system, and generally not at all elitist.
I cannot fathom why Labour would be distracted by this nonsense right now - there is an open goal waiting to be scored but they will predictably miss it.
If ever there was an easy election to win against the lying buffoon Johnson the time to push forward sensible policies is now. If Corbyn canât manage this simple task I will hold him responsible.
It is very clear that Labour are now only comfortable being in opposition.
I would so dearly love the Tories to get a thrashing at the polls and to see Johnson, Gove, Raab & Reece-Mogg lose their seats - which are all possible. Unless something drastically changes on either side it simply isnât going to happen.
For those who appear to be Blind Believers in Corbyn - I have to say the future is looking grim for your cause.
I can only see that Corbyn will step down shortly after the GE but unfortunately by then the damage of Brexit will be about to happen.
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Fascinating, though, that after the initial poll on the ITV Corbyn-Johnson head-to-head showing a dead heat, it is now emerging that among undecided voters Corbyn won a decisive victory, with a 59-41 per cent lead over Johnson - and Johnson has just pulled out of the second scheduled C4 head-to-head.
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Very astute comments, Geof.
It wouldnât surprise me if Johnsonâs minders seriously limited his âvox popâ
jerk-offs around the burger bars and market stalls of Brexitborough-oop-North, where heâs likely to get arse-whipped.
Not that prime-time TV will be around to record his scourging. The received media wisdom is still that he has the common touchâŚ
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Sadly the media will not report on the this in a measured way, but whip up and âabolitionâ frenzy to stop moderate people moving towards labour. Closing tax loopholes seems hugely sensible to me as I have never understood how it could be perpetuated, and how it is ethical that rich people can tax breaks on paying private school fees.
Agreed Jane. Thereâs lots of evidence that Labourâs policies are very popular (broadly, 60% + of the electorate agree with them) but that negative media coverage puts people off actually voting Labour.
A proper study of this with particular reference to the âantisemitismâ controversy has just been published in fact. It forensically documents the media distortions - not just in the murdoch/tabloid press but throughout supposedly neutral media like the BBC. Among the starkly revealing findings is that the general public believe that an average of 34% of Labour Party members have been accused of anti-semitism - but the actual figure is 0.1% (one in every thousand - and many of these were actually unfounded).
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Just so Iâm clear Geof, is it your interpretation of this possible Labour policy that after integration there wonât be any private/fee paying schools?
One manâs* drastic is another manâs radical and transformative. Labourâs policy is widely regarded by voters, including many who are still undecided, as the latter: reasonable, practicable, equitable, patriotic and fair. To those who say âLife isnât fair!â I counter with âLife is what we make it, togetherâ.
Patriotic in the sense of capable of making the nation whole again, with a distributive and inclusive economy, not casino winner-takes-all capitalism.
As for those who doubt the Labour message of hope, not fear, I take comfort in the words of Labour Internationalâs timeless anthem and call, for people everywhere, to action:
âWhen cowards flinch, and traitors sneer, weâll keep the Red Flag (the Peopleâs Flag) flying here!â
*I must stress that the use of the word man in this context is not gendered, and should be read to include all humankind, women and men equally and, in this particular and all similar general contexts, without tendentious distinction.
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The Labour Party is not vindictive, because we (itâs membership) value all citizens equally, and support their right to justice in all its applications.
The Partyâs firm commitment in Government is to remove the charitable tax status that private schools provide, in the first parliament.
No - Iâm sure private schools will continue - as I said near the start of this thread there is a clear and strong âleft-wingâ case for schools not fully in the state system, for specific educational philosophies (Steiner Schools, for example) - but I envisage these being much more like âprivateâ schools in France - semi-private, if you like - not elitist, not very expensive, not distant from their local communities.
The specific mention of âtax loopholesâ in the manifesto is most interesting. Not many people are aware that one of the complications around charitable status in the UK - or rather England & Wales - Scottish law actually differs here - is that it is effectively supervised by 2 bodies - the Charity Commission and HMRC - that frequently differ in their interpretation. Iâve used the âloopholesâ this creates many times for clients in my professional life! But it sounds to me like Labour want to look at removing charitable tax status but not charitable legal status - which would mean allowing private schools to keep their charitable endowments, etc (most if not all the assets they have built up as charities).
When it comes to Labour there is a very clear lesson in all this: NEVER believe the media version!
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The Labour manifesto is undoubtedly clear and concise with the proposed spending (sorry investment) obviously fully costed, the huge question is as always - where will the money come from if the tax receipts simply arenât there? Of course the answer is again as always - borrow more. Now if people are happy with that they should vote for Jezza and let him lead them all to the land of Oz.
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The huge âelephant in the roomâ question is always, where do Tory governments and Tory-lite governments like Blairâs New Labour find the money to fund disastrous and contrived foreign wars?
They always do. Of course, it keeps the monstrous and lucrative death-machinery of war well oiled, fuelled and extended, with the assistance of despotic allies like the Saudis, who have money to burn.
People are not stupid, they can see through the lies and obfuscations of decaying imperialist elites: here, in Europe, across the Atlantic in the Americas, and on other continents world-wide, the world is waking up; the tide is turning.
The only added comment needed is that the rise from 2007 (collapse of Northern Rock) to 2009 was not down to Labour policies - it was caused by the crazy Tory bankers.
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I could also, by the way, put up figures showing that on average each year in government, going right back to the war, the Tories have borrowed more than Labour, have repayed less, and the accumulated debt of the Tories is therefore much higher than Labourâs.
It is, Iâm afraid, another murdoch/tabloid myth that Labour is less prudent than the Tories - the opposite is the case.
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So adding to the debt is okay?
Iâm truly thankful that youâre around, Geof, to set the account straight about Labourâs history in Government, and shed light on the disinformation and lies peddled by the right wing media in UK, and uncritically swallowed by many.
My own experience is only that of a life-long public servant in healthcare, where successive Tory governments have bled it dry, fragmented provision, and set up divisive âmarket-styleâ policies that have turned healthcare into a commodity ripe for private picking over.
Care of the elderly, and mental health care is almost entirely in the quasi-charitable aka âindependent sectorâ where standards have plummeted, skilled staff driven out in favour of cheap labour, and geographically isolated prison-like regimes installed like those in which young mentally challenged youngsters are locked up in windowless rooms, fed through a slot in the door, and restrained so that they sustain life threatening injuries, or die. Iâve served as a chaplain (and as a nurse) in several of these in the 1990s and 2000s, and they defy description. Gagging orders apply.
I never thought it could happen. It is worse than the 1950s, and should scandalise us all.
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