I suppose I’m thinking too far ahead but I have a very large cave that I’ve excavated with a view to using it as a sort of workshop, storage space for motorbike, bicycles and tons of other stuff I seem to have accumulated and should really throw away 
I’m putting in a concrete floor and would like to plaster the walls but if that moves from a cave to a habitable space, given it’s size, it could have a disproportionate impact on my taxe foncière. I’d like to stay just on the right side on uninhabitable 
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With a bit of luck and no bed in there that sounds like a storage room or games room.
I gather a lot of London suburban houses had games rooms that were built in their attic. Not 4th bedrooms, but games rooms. And advertised as such by estate agents. Ahem.
Storage room sounds good to me 
One of our cellars is starting to look like a medieval church, I’m in the process of cleaning up and pointing the joints, the arch work is taking time and giving me a stiff neck. Mrs W, slept down there during the last heatwave and wants it to be a heatwave bunker / bedroom and her artist’s work shop. Can’t see any problems in what you have in mind unless you rent it out type chambre d’hôte or selling the house advertising it as anything other than a cellar/workshop.
John: if your property is an old one, I would strongly advise against concrete in favour of limecrete and lime plaster rather than standard plasterboard.
I have 2 friends with old (200 years+) houses who have replaced earth floors with concrete: they now have damp coming up the walls.
Well worth googling “Peter Ward damp”.
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Gabby: to me there are a number of warning signs that may not be first apparent:
- that well known large English estate agency;
- elderly British owners who only used the property as a holiday home;
- lack of diagnostics for key areas / items.
My view is that once you have the complete diagnostics, you will then be in a much better place to make informed decisions regarding whether to proceed or not and perhaps a revised offer.
My own property purchase experience may be of interest.
L bought our house through that well known agency from British owners who had only used the house as a holiday home. I noticed two warning signs: the plastic garden chairs being used as bedroom furniture and the £1 round paper Woolworths lampshades. (Did I mention that the previous owners were a pair of incompetent, tight-fisted bodgers??). I had a professional survey carried out. The mandatory inspection revealed severe problems with the gas CH boiler – which was immediately condemned, the survey that I commissioned exposed issues with the roof beams.
My offer was 10% below their (reduced) asking price. Mistake – I should have offered 20% below!
BTW, the CH boiler was replaced at the vendors expense.
What only came to light once we had moved in was:
- extensive problems with the electrics (whole house had to be rewired)
- leaky ‘garage’ roof
- amateur shoddy plasterboard work.
Almost 4 years later, are we glad that we bought the house? Yes – but wished that we had paid a lot less.
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I think you’ve hit the nail on the head…
Most properties will have issues of one sort or another… mostly minor, but the major ones can be ghastly if not budgeted for.
If one can have a reasonable idea of just what one is taking on,… and make an offer based on that… all well and good.
We fell in love with our house on the first/only visit, before even getting out of the car… and we knew it would need “intensive care”. Still happy with our choice, impoverished but very happy… 
and it’s still not “finished”, even after all these years… 
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We too! Have spent again what we paid for it in bringing it up to scratch - rewiring / new lounge floor / replumbing /new central heating system / new bathroom / insulation / replastering / new fosse septique and pipework to bring that to conformity/new kitchen. And, like you, still not finished. 
@Gabby : Ours too was a second home for 15 years, not visited at all during some years. As soon as we moved in most of the stuff they left us (cooker/central heating boiler / wood burner in the lounge / washing machine/ etc/etc) had to be replaced. What was fine for 2 weeks in the summer definitely wasn’t for winter
We sort of knew what we faced, but not quite to what extent.
If you have deep pockets and you are prepared to spend as much again as you buy it for than maybe you can go ahead. But be under no illusion that this will be a place you can just move into and live happily ever after.
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Ours was a second home for 25 years. We are veeeeery slowly improving it but my goodness it’s no fun in the winter However, in no way at all do I regret it
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I must add that we had visited France especially to view properties on several occasions that year. Saw some lovely properties which turned out not to be so lovely, once we started asking questions… and we didn’t feel sufficiently drawn to any of them to ignore the warning nudges from our brains… (thankfully).
“love at first sight” has worked twice in our lives… once personal and the other structural…
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Hi Gabby,
I bought a house at the end of 2020. I had a full diagnostique done beforehand, which has to be produced by law and paid for by the owners. I already knew, though, that I would have to renovate pretty much everything inside–heating, plumbing, electrics, etc., so I did know what I was walking into. Have you seen your diagnostique, which should contain a list of all elements that might need repair or replacement?
I ought also to add that in spite of the diagnostique, I’ve been caught out by one thing, which is that French prices for any sort of work on your house are about three times what they are in the UK. I made the mistake of calculating my budget based on quite a lot of experience of renovating a Victorian house in the UK, but it seems as if it’s quite normal for people to charge 1000€ for changing a single light fitting, and 2000€ to make a detailed quote for repair work… I exaggerate, but only slightly. The other thing to know is that right now, and perhaps even under non-pandemic circumstances, it is taking nine months to get even a basic survey of the sockets and switches done so the renovation can begin, and similarly with the other work that needs doing. Fortunately, I’m not dependent on my house for an income nor do I have to live in it just yet. But if you are, then this may be a big issue if you decide to proceed and then need a repair.
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Because they have to be qualified insured and pay social charges. And of course it isn’t a 100% guarantee they will be good, just as eg in UK you don’t always get monkeys if you pay peanuts.
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…And that’s even if you can find someone to do the work.
For as long as we’ve been here it’s been difficult to find tradesmen in France. They seem to have more than enough work.always somewhere else. I’m also wondering if, like quite a few people here, they’d rather live in (work on) a shiny new house made of breeze blocks or thermolite and cheaply plastered rather than a lovely old stone building.
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Time and specialist labour costs money thats why many firms don’t work on stone buildings besides the headache of customers who thing that its just a case of putting one stone on top of another so shouldn’t cost anything.
Weird. I wonder why they would think someone would automatically assume any form of building work wouldn’t cost an appropriate amount for someone’s time regardless of the material their house is built in.
Our site has various stones that I’ve worked out at least some of which must go back to megalithic (stone worshipping) days and our building is well proportioned stone but I would assume work must cost what it should. The difficulty seems to be for most trades here not just stone-related.
There are specialists and stonemasons etc … it’s a question of finding 'em.
Perhaps consider contacting your Mairie, Community of Communes, Batiment de France. All of those should be able to point you in the right direction…
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We learnt the hard way. It’s much easier to get artisans via a project manager. As incomers (I think it would have been the same for Parisians) they did not know us or trust us. So while we were using a non-local architect we could not get anyone we asked to quote. The moment we got rid of the architect and brought in the local well-known / well-trusted “maître d’œuvre” we found we had a team.
Also, there is a real limit to how far most are prepared to travel (maybe a reason for not living too remotely). All our workmen came from the local town and surrounding villages so it meant no more than 20 minutes drive home for lunch at 12 noon and back again by 2pm.
It still took about 9 months to get things started, because as other have said they were busy and as said elsewhere the French work to live, not live to work. Also, there may be tax disadvantages in taking on too much work.
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Hi Gabby
Until you sign a compromis de vente you are not legally obliged to pursue your offer despite what the estate agent may say.
If the property is under 10 years old all the “problems” with it would be covered by a décénnale - which is a 10 year guarantee on all major works even if the said works have been made by the owners. However after 10 years there are no longer any guarantees and vices cachés only apply in certain extreme cases and it is down to the buyer to prove that the seller knew of the problem before he sold the property. It can be a very lengthy and onerous procedure.
You can indeed include various clauses in the compromis which would get you out of a pickle.
Finally you can commission of full assessment of the property at quite a high cost before you sign a compromis.
All in all it is down to how much you like the property and how far are you prepared to risk investing in it. Bonne chance!
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Because macons are considered lowest of the low maybe.
If so that’s very sad, Flocreen !
I have one repair needing doing by a maçon and it’s easy to see that doing it right will require someone that really knows their trade.