Why do we argue?

iT WAS not my theory.

However I will not turn it into an argument and admit that it was possibly

not a prudent idea to quote someone else. But I do make mistakes and, I believe that

a person who is willing to admit error is capable of diffusing an inflamed conversation.

Do not all politicians not go through their political lives managing to disprove their own theories...

as they constantly change courses and need to justify each new direction....

Interesting how we manage to judge others to fortify our own power.

Yes....I do believe that there are trances of power hunger in all of us.

Congratulations, you just managed to disprove your own theory !

John, to be honest the comment was second hand.

I asked someone this question last night and that was their reactive concept.

However I have noted that on occasion some people have declared

an argument just to show that they are a powerful personality.

Yes, you can solicit the views of others without argument.

Some people have an argumentative nature.

I am not so sure that I am arrogant.....

Just putting forward a suggestion...

I don't think so Barbara and in fact I find that a tad arrogant, one can solicit others' views without argument. It's misplaced eqo at play here that, at times, is the problem. Just because one posts twenty times a day doesn't mean one is "right". In fact IMHO those that post most say least.

We argue to instigate the opinions of others.

It depends, Jane. 78% of how many? In lozere road deaths leapt one year by something like 200 % if memory serves. There were three as opposed to one!

I missed the particular row you reference Carol but in my humble opinion the reason there are “rows” is because there are two distinct types of posters/threads on this site, though neither is mutually exclusive. There are those of us that find it a valuable source of information which tends to be factual with not too much room for disagreement and there are those that use it (dominate it?) as a social network which requires (hopefully friendly and respectful) disagreement to liven it up. It’s tricky to balance the two objectives. One way might be to limit folk to a certain number of posts per day (or limit the number of characters posted) because I do think some people spend more time on here than is healthy. They’re spending more time in Cyberspace then in France :slight_smile:

If someone is born in the UK and qualifies for citizenship because at least the mother is in permanent residence, which sometimes need to be proven, then the child is entitled to be a UK national. However, parents have the right to register their child at the embassy or consulate of their country, or if of two different nationalities may choose. This applies to all non-UK people wherever the parents are from.

It is also possible that a child born in the UK with every right to citizenship but with one non-UK parent could be registered at the embassy or consulate for that parent. I have a friend born in London to an English mother and US father who only has the US citizenship. He was born, grew up, educated and learned a profession in the UK, has a very English accent and manners yet has never applied for the UK passport he would be entitled to since he is effectively a dual national. The nationality of my own dual national children is given as Swiss here as first choice.

There is simply no obligation other than the legal requirement to register a birth within a reasonable time, I believe a month is generally the maximum tolerated by most public authorities but 42 days is the legal maximum for birth registration. That is more than adequate time for the issue of a passport, ID card or other instrument of registration such as a certificate or family book by nearly all diplomatic presentations, who otherwise issue a pro forma to show that registration has been carried out and that the formal document is to follow.

Internationally, a birth certificate is considered the most visible evidence of a government’s legal recognition of the existence of a child as a member of society and is considered a basic human right, yet worldwide an estimated 51 million babies, around 40% of all births, are not registered each year. There are thus said to be over 220 million unregistered children when late registration and doing so for entry into primary education is achieved. Thus, people without have no official identity, recognised name and nationality. They are almost inevitably, the children of the poor and excluded thus contributing to exacerbating poverty since these people grow up to face the likelihood of being denied access to education (even where compulsory), employment, even health services including mass inoculation programmes. Registration is obligatory but many people cannot afford it or are either afraid of or lack access to the registering authority. Even within their natural or birth countries such people are classified stateless.

In the UK the Registrar General has usually estimated around 3.5% of live births remain unregistered at 42 days, around 25,000 children, of whom one or two percent remain so until adulthood. There is a fine of up to £200 for non-registration. However, the children of stateless parents, sometimes refugees, the UN rather than national authorities issues travel documents for stateless people and refugees, including certificates of identity, aka 'alien's passports' (Beam me up, Scotty) and refugee travel documents.

That is all I know from my professional area, there's probably much more tricky stuff about it in UK bureaucratise.

Well put Brian thank you for clearing that up for me and maby some others here.

Brian i whant to pick your brains

Q: What if your origins .eg: (someone from France/any were). are not British but you were born in the UK are you still British ? or some one out side of the EU if that counts

need sleep , last sip of wine zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Literally, it is a regional appellation that applies to all people who are of the British Isles, the archipelago in its geographic entirety, thus including the Irish who don't like being told that, but excluding Shetlanders who are not from the British Isles, also the Channel Islanders. Because the British Isles (and some other bits) came to be ruled by a single monarch, to encapsulate all of the four country's peoples a generic was created, ergo British. The label has stuck since. However, it now includes people entitled to UK citizenship so that it has drifted away from originally meaning of one of the countries forming the British Isles. So that people with any origin can now be born or become British. In that sense it is now an absurd continuation of a generalisation and thus allows somebody, myself in this instance, to say Scot and European but not use British. In that sense, it is a matter of choice and assumption of an identity.

This ^^

we need the thumbs up option on this forums plz

Brian what do you call British someone that was born and has their roots in the UK or some one that has just lived in the uk?

eg: i would say i am Britsh family website

I rather think the latter of the two gives one up eventually rather than one giving it up but that's beginning to sound like an argument which I'm studiously trying to avoid !

Where the sun don't shine? Of course if they were twisted economists (aren't they all ?) it could be a Mobious Strip in which case it would be like this economist thread.... Going nowhere :-)

Still not arguing !

Errh, avez-vous un cuppa ?

In fact, it would become a spiral ending up....... (rest censored).

Nun! Du willst darüber auseinandersetzen?

Well, a viewing is a viewing and they have been non-existant this year. It only takes one mug I mean, customer !

Fags were an absolute doddle to give up. Don't I could ever give up meat or sex tho'...

Ok, now what can we argue about ?

Glad things are well. One of our bouley boys has just had a total right hand shoulder replacement & he's back playing after 1 week. He's using the other arm mind you but nobody has noticed 'cos he was rubbish with his right hand anyway :-)

I fancy an argument but my resolve is holding firm at the moment. It was easier giving up the fags !! ;-)

Good luck with the house sale.

Well said Carol but don't be sad. We rarely really 'argue' with each other , it's more like heated discussions. I get it that some people are more fragile than others & are taken aback by some of the rhetoric here but it's usually amongst them that can give & take it, is seldom personal & hopefully never directed at those who are unwilling or unable to participate for whatever reasons. Sometimes things get out of hand but they normally quickly cool. People can always move down the table if they don't like what they are hearing & in that way the dinner party atmosphere is conserved. You & I have 'fallen' out in the past but that's where it is, in the past. I don't hold grudges & hopefully nobody else does 'cos that 'aint the way it should be. This is a big place now & there's no way that everybody will agree with what's said or how it's said but generally we rub along quite well so don't worry about us. :-) I'm still not arguing !