Advice needed damp in wall which is underground level

I get that with one of the well pumps, you just touch the rope and it kicks in, ended up connecting a piece of string to the rope and then to a branch on a bush next to the well head, if there is any wind it shakes the rope for me :yum:
Not a practical solution in your basement though :grin:

I’m finding myself wondering if an electronic switch would work

It’s possible it just got stuck - at the moment the water is filling the sump quite quickly but at a rate which is lower than the pump capacity (officially 2.8l/sec) so the pump is not running continuously but at a 50-60% (approx) duty cycle. In turn that means the float must be shuffling up and down every 10-15 seconds, it only needs to get stuck on one of these cycles to stop it dead in its tracks.

Hmm, if the float has a short bearing surface it could twist slightly and jam. If the bearing was longer this is less likely if there is any room to lengthen it? No doubt a tube of some sort where I say bearing, its a bearing surface.

Actually I’m liking @Badger’s suggestion more for another reason - as observed the bottom of the sump is not very big, in turn that means not much volume â€‰is needed to trigger the pump. As the first section of pipe is vertical there is quite a bit of backwash when it switches off.

At present it is running about 50% duty cycle with 5 seconds of pumping and 5 seconds dead time. I suspect that will itself be a strain on the pump which won’t be removing water very efficiently and a 550W device running a 50% duty cycle is 6 units a day which isn’t cheap.

Basic non return valve could sort that.

I tried a non return valve on the well pump, but it clogged up, this might not happen on a basement pump as there won’t be so much grit.
Looking at that outboard switch it looks like a better bet for you.

But that wont prevent the over cycling?

Only a bigger sump will do that, because they aren’t there most of the time it hopefully would stop the flooded basement due to the float sticking .

Yes if enlarging the sump is doable then the standard cable float can be used which seldom get stuck. I would still put a non return valve in, even if it did get dirt in the flapper that would only lead to an activation of the pump as it does now but without dirt affecting it the cyling would still be reduced.

If I was there I would think about a nrv, I wouldn’t if I wasn’t there all the time I wouldn’t, used them on 3 pumps and they all gummed up.

It would, because I’d have it much higher - above the top of the pump - before turning the thing on. Actually I need two sensors, one high to turn it on and one low to turn it off - I don’t think the hysteresis on a single switch would be enough. I wonder if such a set up exists.

Enlarging the sump would be something I wouldn’t wish to try myself.

NRV might also be an idea, one would not preclude the other, of course.

Edit: Even without two sensors this would reduce cycling as the sump has a wider top section and cramped lower section in which the pump sits. For a given change in height there would be a higher volume of water pumped if the float switch were in the upper section.

Promising?

There’s already a small DIN housing for the interrupter - can swap that for one which will hole both the main switch and the controller. Just need to figure out what those control inputs need.

OK figured it - I need a 24V isolated supply which connects to A1/2, the sensors are just electrodes (so I suspect AC supply would be better) and there’s a SPDT switch for the pump.

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Depends on the length of the lead you give the switch to a degree. Normally the ordinary tilt switches inside the floats operate around 4 to 6 inches of differential.

One well has a double float switch now and on the other I went to a round float instead of the rectangular one which has not stuck in the last year since installing, our other house uses the double float in the basement.
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So - the solution for now has, indeed, been to wedge an old bit of tile on the ledge halfway down the sump and sit the pump on that. The result is that the duty cycle has gone down to 1:4 - about 5-6 seconds activation every 20.

Longer term I think the GRL8 is the way to go, plus an NRV if I can get one with 1" fittings.

We used to get all our NRV from plastic to brass/s steel from water fitters.

Bits ordered, Jeff’s French cousin** is bringing them over later in the week

** Amazon :slight_smile:

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Bits arrived, electrics can wait until the summer, NRV fitted after a bit of a fight with the pipework (and again when I realised I had it in backwards).

Thanks for that suggestion - somewhat kicking myself that I didn’t think of it but managed to get it right at the pump output so no dead space at all really.

The sump has an upper section 30x35cm and 35cm deep, then there is a lower section which is 25x30cm x20cm deep.

The range for the float between “pump on” and “pump off” is 10cm - with the pump sitting on a couple of tiles to hold it in the upper section that means 9.5l (allowing for whatever is displaced by the pump, call it a litre) for each time the pump activates. In the lower section it would only be 6.5l - 2m of 25mm hose is about another litre which is no longer washing back down the pipe so the changes have roughly doubled what the pump shifts each time it is activated - that should reduce cycling and hence wear and tear.

Once I switch over to the electronic control I can probably get a on/off delta of at least 35cm and shift more like 25-30l each time the pump activates which I think will be much better for its long term health.

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Yours and the pumps :yum:
You shouldn’t get the silt that I get from the wells so no blockage of the NRV.

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