Experiences hiring immigration lawyers / relocation expert

Moving to or from France
1

Hey all,

We are a British family (2 of us and a small baby) currently living in Sweden. We have been here over 5 years, and just gained permanent residency. For a multitude of reasons, we are considering a move to France. I think we have a good case for residency, but also I would like to enlist the help of a professional to see whether the plan is actually a goer, and then to help us apply if so.

When we moved to Sweden, I did all the residency admin myself, but of course it was pre-Brexit, and Swedish Beauracrats speak flawless English. That said, it’s still had its share of headaches. Does anyone have experience hiring a lawyer or ‘relocation expert’ when applying for residency in France? Positive experiences or horror stories? I just spent a considerable amount on Swedish accountancy fees so I’m familiar with professional hourly rates! Can anyone recommend any specific persons?

Thanks!

H

(in case anyone mentions citizenship, yes we have applied for Swedish citizenship, yes the populist / far right now have a toe hold in Swedish politics, and yes they are changing the laws on requirements this June, which will even apply retroactively to existing applications!) :distorted_face:

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I think most UK citizen French residents on here did their own applications, because it’s not that difficult.

But the fact that you’re asking the question suggests that you’re coming to France to work, and not as an employee. I may be wrong.

So why don’t you tell us a bit more about yourself: even if we don’t have all the answers, we will be able to help you clear some of the ground.

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If you have EU permanent residency and the card/stamp to prove it you can just move here and apply for your new residency permit after arrival from the préfecture where you decide to settle. However this may be more time consuming, frustrating and drawn out than just applying for the visa you need in Sweden (where you know how things operate too). Many stories of people pulling their hair out and immigration experts can’t help. The préfecture will do what it does at the speed it chooses.

And of course if you just move you can’t work until you have the permit which can take 6 months or more.

Deciding which visa you need, and applying for it in advance is really quite straightforward and is designed to be done by the applicant.

So think carefully about which option you follow.

As for using a relocation service it really depends on whether you see this as a good use of money. We found doing everything ourselves more fun, and gained a lot of knowledge from the process which has proved invaluable. Perhaps a bit slower, but you remain in complete control. Most times it is you who has to produce the paperwork anyway.

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Can’t really add any info. I had thought about the permanency rights in Sweden as well - my first thought.

But it was Jane Jones’ comment ‘…doing everything ourselves more fun…’ - to be one of the funniest comments ever about dealing with the french bueurocracy !!! Thanks for the giggle !!

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Fun is in the eye of the beholder! I’ve spent 5 years dealing with all the admin associated with being an expat here in Sweden (my partner has many strengths, but paperwork isn’t one of them) and fun is not the word I would use for it! I’d be happy to sub at least some of this out to an expert at a cost, but only if it’s worth doing.

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Actually, years ago… having to do the rounds of various govt offices etc etc alone and having to speak with officials was fun more often than it was ghastly.

It all depends on the person one is dealing with face to face and one’s own ability to communicate.
I carefully prepared short sentences using easy words for me to say. Thus I explained my needs/doubts and often I think my plight appealed to their better nature/compassion.

Hopefully @HerewardTheWoke has a decent command of French, whether or not he uses Experts to do the initial Administration is up to him and his wallet.

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Thanks for the reply.

In response to JaneJones, we can prove our EU permanent residency (have our appointment for fingerprints etc in a few weeks), and I’m vaguely aware that is one pathway to residency in France(?). Still waiting on our baby’s Swedish res. to be approved, as getting the UK passport has been a bit longwinded (endless birth certificates required), I’m not 100% sure whether her res. will be permanent like ours (something I need to look into).

You’re correct, I’m self employed and have been for 5 years. I work from home, remotely carrying out energy surveys, all my work is carried out for UK clients as its specifically for UK building regulations. In fact, I actually only really work for one client as a sub contractor, people on other forums (well reddit) highlighted that might be an issue. But I am most definitely self employed and have years of records to prove that. I could diversify my client base, if neccessary. Last year before tax I made around £28k, previous years have been a little less.

In terms of other resources, I’m lucky enough to have significant savings and investments. Sadly my dad passed away last year, he left behind a large estate that is currently being split between me and my siblings. It’s still in administration but when all is said and done, I will have around £1.5m in investments / savings (with a few hundred thousand earmarked for a house in France). It feels a bit crude to mention a figure but I know it is important.

My partner is a stay at home mum. We aren’t married, but have discussed getting married if it would make moving to France more straightforward (who said romance was dead!). So all our resources would be shared legally.

We are looking at living somewhere rural, and buying a house. Right now it’s between Brittany and the Pyrénées-Atlantiques. We have travelled a lot through France in our campervan before moving to Sweden, and even spent 6 months living in a gîte in Lorraine over the first COVID! So are quite familiar with day to day life; however we’ve never come into contact with the bureaucracy. I speak a little French, and would of course learn more before we moved, but I want to know if it’s a feasible plan before I commit.

So as far as I can tell we have a few routes to residency; through our permanent Swedish residency, through my employment, and through self sufficiency. I’m also a bit confused where the baby would fit into the picture.

Beyond that I’ll admit I haven’t done massess of research, juggling a newborn baby and other commitments has been taking up a lot of my time!

Any advice massively appreciated!

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Also, it is very important to understand that money vanishes like snow in a heatwave.. when one moves to a new country. Especially money-draining is the new home, building works, changes and absolutely everything else.

Of course, this whole thing can also be the most wonderful adventure/fun and I wish you and your family every happiness in France.

(We’ve never regretted our decision to come here.)

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Hope you’re not literally juggling baby! But baby is a minor so is attached to you both and will not need a separate visa (but perhaps get a DCEM or swedish equivalent)

Yes having a sole client can be a bar to being an auto-entrepreneur here. But if you can clearly show that it is not subordinate position and disguised employment then it’s fine. So you need to set your hours, your charges etc etc. And if you can indicate that you will look for other clients then all the better.

Self-sufficiency will mean you can’t work for at least 5 years, so a prof liberale visa obtained whilst in Sweden may be best for your circumstances.

If you decide not to get married then buy any property in tontine which is a way to circumnavigate the risk if something happens to one of you.

Problem is that still ends up as you having to produce the various bits of paper. France is an admin heavy country so the sooner you get used to it the better?

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Thanks so much! Correct, baby is not yet at an age where is can be launched into the air (at least so I’m told by my partner).

Re: work, I absolutely set my own fees and my own hours. I think I’ll look into diversifying to just a few extra clients just because.

Do understand what you are saying re: the admin. I think I’m just coming off the back of having to apply for our permanent residency (last November) then two citizenship applications, then a babies residency app and also UK passport application! So feeling a bit fatigued. I think what I want is someone to basically tell us that, given our specific circumstances, we either are or aren’t eligible for residency. When we moved to Sweden it all felt quite secure because it was pre-Brexit, whereas this move feels quite a lot more uncertain.

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Haha yes of course I’m familiar. Living in Sweden isn’t exactly cheap, I have spent my fair share on some ill advised property decisions here. And you should see the electricity bills … 600 euro per month this winter just past, and we are in southernmost Sweden. Ultimately my gut feeling is that we’d be happier in France, even if it meant spending a bit (or a lot) to get there!

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That would be a change of pace doing everything face to face, as here it’s almost all done digitally (something the Swedes are a big fan of). My French right now is not great, but I absolutely wouldn’t move to France without improving it considerably, this is a mid-term plan for us right now. Appreciate all the advice :slightly_smiling_face:

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So if I want to work out if this is a feasible plan without the help of an ‘expert’, what’s the best way to go about doing it? I’ve done some reading on https://france-visas.gouv.fr/ which I assume is the original font of knowledge, anywhere else to read up on this? Say we stay in Sweden and make the application here (not an issue and feels more wise), do we wait until the decision is made before moving? I have read you need accomodation arranged in advance in order to apply for at least some of the visas.

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I can’t speak for Sweden, but applications made in the UK seem to be successful even when based on a 3 month holiday rental (which of course can be cancelled).

There are quite a few people on here who have been through the process post-Brexit so may be able to provide informed comment on your plans. But the theory is simple. I’m sure you have looked at this, but follow it to the letter and all should be well. Don’t overthink things and make sure it is clear that all your clients will be outside France - unless of course you have EU qualifications.

And getting an avis favorable allows you to put things in place then.

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Thank you so much! I think I will shelve the idea of an immigration lawyer for now and really go through the different visas available and the application process online before deciding how to proceed. Based on the personal information I’ve provided, do you think we would have a good chance of residency?

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Visas are individual, but being married could be better for your partner if you are the one with the healthy bank balance. Recent changes for citizenship have shown a hardening of attitudes for stay at home partners - which doesn’t of course translate directly to visa requests but there is a financial threshold that she will need to meet for a non-workimg visitor visa.

For you the question might be why France if all your clients are outside France. Your qualifications aren’t relevant here, so may need to show a reason for being here.

No-one can say if you’ll be successful or not. Do the business plan, submit it for an avis favorable and if you don’t get one maybe think again?