HDL, LDL & Cholesterol etc

Like many here probably I have six-monthly 'routine' blood tests. And also like many, trying to keep cholesterol levels within the normal parameters gets more tricky with age and lifestyle etc. My blood test results in november 2015 showed a slight increase on the previous six months with all readings showing a steady decline in the overall well being regarding HDL, LDL & cholesterol levels. Following the november results my GP suggested I try to improve these results or face being put on drugs to chemically get the readings to a more acceptable level.

From november I changed three things

a) Drank only green tea - I love tea and can quite easily get through six cups each day. I don't drink coffee for no other reason than I don't like it ! The tea I have been drinking has been Ginger & Lemon, Ginseng, Yunnan Natural and Camomile an hour before going to bed.

b) An increase in exercise - walking for about one hour each day unless i've been grass cutting with a push-mower (no posh ride-ons here !) or doing other physical graft.

c) Eating more food likely to help reduce cholesterol - The 'usuals' like oats ( I love porridge), red wine, dark chocolate etc etc but an important food i've introduced into my diet is grenadine seeds. They can be eaten in a fruit or non-fruit salad or as topping in a yoghurt or just as they are. They are brill in the middle of a melon.

I have not dieted and I eat EVERYTHING ! I'm not a great drinker nowadays but the red wine flows ok. I eat what and when I want as before so this isn't a wonder diet quite simply a way to reduce cholesterol NATURALLY. It isn't a gimmick and i'm just an ordinary person so trust me when I say it works for me.

Now the important bit - the results.

LDL or 'bad' cholesterol reduced to 1.24 g/L from 1.53 g/L in november

HDL or 'good' cholesterol remains stable at about 0.50 g/L

Total Cholesterol is now at 2.01 g/L from 2.34 g/L in november !

Hope this helps anyone trying to reduce.

Sounds great Keith - carry on with the recovery

I'm 66 too, nearly didn't make 65; my heart attack was two years ago and I have four stents in there keeping the blocked arteries open - good so far. I am on average six kilos down, lots of extra exercise, diet watched like a hawk and I already had lots of exercise and a healthy diet! It is what we consume rather than the amount. The HDLs and LDLs are easy enough to keep an eye on. As fit as I considered myself to be up until three years ago, changing habits and food is not easy, especially if there are others in the family to consider, but I do and sometimes even cook something else or have the heavy stuff as a treat. Luckily my implants went in via an artery in my right arm, so whilst I was under anaesthetic, I was more away than out and watched the whole thing. Fascinating as it may have been, don't want another really. Keep up what you intend Keith and everybody else take that advice.

I meant to reply to this a while ago, but forgot. My reading up on vitamin C eventually led me to the belief that it's an amazing substance, and completely safe. To quote Suzanne Humphries: "Vitamin C is one of the safest medical wonders on the planet.". However, the thing that is not well understood about vitamin C is that the doses have to be high enough to get the results. Any vitamin C that you take, whether in your food or in supplements, will do you good, but when it is used to cure diseases the doses get huge, like more than 100g per day. In my trials I'm taking about 12g to 14g per day at the moment, gradually increasing it to see what happens.

If you want to research this for yourself look at articles or YouTube videos by Thomas Levy and Suzanne Humphries, or books by Steve Hickey or Irwin Stone.

Hi Peter
I thought so, and you will find some very interesting articles in Dr Mercolla newsletter. He is very thorough and often challenges mainstream peddled thinking in relation to health and wellness. Worth a try as you can always unsubscribe. BTW I am not affiliated with him or his site in any way so its not a commercial post. Anyhow... try here http://www.mercola.com/
Have a great day.

Also you may find this VERY interesting...


Wendy, isn't it about what most of our parents were always telling us ie "eat a well balanced diet and eat and drink everything in moderation" ?

I don't know if anyone has already mentioned this, but we are asking the wrong questions about heart disease apparently- see http://www.disclose.tv/news/World_Renowned_Heart_Surgeon_Speaks_Out_On_What_Really_Causes_Heart_Disease/113103#.VWjsPr6VWqE.facebook

I have read this elsewhere, too, I haven't checked it out any further, but it makes sense to me. I only know that I went on a very drastic diet many years ago with virtually no fats and ended up feeling very unwell. We now eat a reasonably balanced organic diet including meat, but mostly vegetable/fruit and no processed foods to speak of.

Great article Courteney, very interesting reading.

This makes for very interesting reading


Also, Dr Mercola is a great source of balanced information regarding all matters of health. I have been subscribed to his newsletter for about 8 years and he provides excellent though provoking information.

Brian M & Ian C I’ve just. Aught up with end of this discussion and found it interesting about all the Vit C info, especially as my doc prescribed Vit C supplements by way of small bottles of fruit drink or pots of a yoghurt type mixture - all supplied by the pharmacy. I’ve been doing my own research given various health issues, one of which being cirrhosis, and apparently Vit D is good for the liver, so I now take on e every 2 months, a liquid dose from a phial of something called Uvedose, it is a slow release dosage.

My own researchh into liver problems, non cancer or alcohol related, has also taught me that goes in the mouth progresses to the liver for ‘cleansing’ because toxins of whatever variety are carried round the body by the bloodstream to other organs and systems. I was in good health, and only took Thyroxin (since /2000).I arrived France Jan 2008. Then I was diagnosed borderline type 2 diabetic 2 yrs later & given Metformin, that can affect the Spleen which produces red/white blood cells. 2 bone marrow tests 2012/2014) confirmed my cell production is not normal and then other health problems followed/increased, which many blood tests/mri’s later now confirm its a liver problem, which is the worst of the conditions I’ve had/have. fingers crossed, I don’t have kidney problems.

It so easy to think that when we pop a pill, prescribed or otherwise, into our mouth because we have a headache, the effects of the pill go straight to the brIn and no where else! wrong, down the oesophagus, into the duodenum, stomach, ending up in liver to be processed and carried awY in the blood stream to the brain!pharmaceuticAl scientists used to test their drugs on animals, and used blood tests and observation to see what happened! animals don’t talk. They can’t tell us what is happening to them. I can talk , I know how my body/ health reacts to the myriad of drugs I’ve been given over the last 3 yrs, is there is a connection between them all. just want to know why they have Come along one after the other, that’s why I have done so much internet research. One of the latest meds I was given is Propranolol, by the liver specialist, Which should not be taken with Thyroxin. I was also given by my doctor more recently, an anxiety med, which should not be taken if you have liver problems! If doctors don’t know the do’s and don’t’s of Meds, then they shouldn’t prescribe, because how could we know? I have now looked up online every med I been prescribed since 2000, when I was diagnosed hypothyroid. Most have been long term prescriptions and now discovered that, through a recent blood test, I have autoimmune thyroiditis! So where does that leave me and drugs? I had to go to collect a repeat prescription for
Thyroxine and next blood test, last had 26 results on it. Blood cell counts was still all over the place! So how much of all this is responsible for continuing neural problems, especially as I was well enough to drive almost 600 Kms 3 times in 5 weeks, the last being 4 days before my car accident! The beginning of the end of a normal healthy life! I would urge anyone on several meds, especially if long term, to check very carefully and think if they have noticed any type of personality, changes or complications. I have also recently weaned myself off everything except thyroxin and already, confusion, stress and balance all have marked improvement, so unless and until I know exactly what the risks Are with a new drug, I will not take it. My biggest problem is convincing my doctor. He is not aware of what I’ve told him and doesn’t believe me. He just thinks I’m anxious and wants to give me more, as happened last week, so I refused!

I agree with Jonny Halliday but i'll raise you with Charles Aznavour !

It certainly appears that we are close to our maximum life span, looking at the state of general wear and tear of people in their 80s and beyond. There are obviously exceptions, like Johnny Hallyday :-D but it becomes a question of quality of life, cost of upkeep etc.

That said, surely if we know of ways to spend our time alive in better health, then those should become the norm, shouldn't they?

Much has been said on the question of proof, of science, indeed of good science. A problem with reliance on science is that it gives the impression of certainty when in fact that may be far from the case. In some cases it's possible to be sure 100% of something, but much of the time it isn't.

For yet another example of science that's anything but clear, read this article that speaks about the continuing inability to get the message across about the benefits and effects of Vitamin C (I know I know, broken record). However when reputable organisations make such a dog's breakfast of it, what can we do? So, unlike the Cochrane Collaboration, I'm quite happy to read case observations made by doctors over periods of several decades and take from them evidence of efficacity. I don't believe that, to quote Cochrane, “their uncontrolled observations do not provide valid evidence of benefit”.

I'll continue with my experiment, I just wish that more doctors were willing to try. IV Vitamin C has been a registered medicine (i.e. it's recognised as safe and effective) in New Zealand for a couple of years now, but progress is very very slow.

Modern human beings are so susceptible to so many things. In fact, the reason is partly that we have extended longevity from under 30 years average life expectancy during the early Roman period up to the median life expectancy in the west 67.2 years which is about the same as the world median age across all nations, although actually only about 12% make it over 60, worldwide it is actually only 32. France is a bit over 80 and the UK slightly behind. The point is that in evolutionary terms we have increased longevity at a high price which is our susceptibility to viruses as our number one 'enemy'. We live far too close to each other, whereas 2000 years ago most populations were actually very dispersed. Where there were concentrations we see there were the plagues and other epidemics. They killed a lot of people but also created resistances to virus strains, so the viruses mutated and now we have several thousand viruses generically known as the 'cold germ'. However, a downside is also that cancers that were very rare in the past have increased exponentially. Likewise the wear and tear on the heart and brain giving us heart attacks and strokes. No amount of remedies made by pharma companies, alternative or folk medicine can actually do much about it. We evolved a few tens of thousands of years too fast but we have knowledge and that can be used to keep us in the best possible shape but never as prophylaxae that prevent us catching, developing or suffering any of the things that make us ill, fragile, senile, etc, etc and ultimately dead. The scientist who discovers the panacea will probably be slapped down by Big Pharma but then when they have the rights to the wonder cure he/she will get a Nobel Prize and some of us will benefit. Those in a country like Afghanistan where life expectancies are still in the upper 20s (not just because of the conflicts) will still be as they are for a very, very long time. No vitamin can help that, so as Spock said 'Live long and prosper'.

So there you're only talking about cancer, Brian? Or Vit C in all cases?

Personally, having read so many case histories and watched and listened to doctors who use Vit C extensively and have extraordinary results using it, I'm more than willing to try it and see. I would go as far as to agree with Thomas Levy that vitamin C should be given by default while the doctor considers his diagnosis.

Anyway, my own views. I'm lucky enough not to have any good reason to need high dose vitamin C or any other drugs at all, and one reason I take Vit C is to stay that way. But I'd be more than happy to give it a shot should I have the need (or rather when).

Look at Barrie Cassileth's book, Alternative medicine handbook: the complete reference guide to alternative and complementary therapies, then you will see very constructive evidence that the term orthomolecular medicine was coined by Pauling as part of his effort to establish what is to this day not proven. Almost no medical or scientific experts, including the totally independent ones, support this approach and those who do very quickly pull Fred Klenner's dabbling apart. Ewan Cameron who supported and wrote on C with Pauling has been discredited as a quack in this respect by Big Pharma, of course we would expect that, but independent scientists have torn his research methods, sampling and analysis apart. So, the benefit of the doubt is strong. Bear in mind that Cameron and Pauling were found concretely to also have overdosed Ds to the point of toxicity in their research subjects, so we must take it all with a pinch of salt.

I like the idea of supplementing with Laphroaig. :-)

Here is another article on Vit C. There's so much case history evidence from doctors that have been using it that it seems almost criminal that it's not in widespread use. There's just incredible inertia against change and for maintaining the status quo.

Ian, that hits the nail on the head in the closing paragraph. Most medical research has been funded by pharma giants, even to the point that when the Pauling versus Crick and Watson argument on the correct model of the double helix DNA was running, both researches were pharma funded. Indeed back in 1869 when Miescher actually discovered DNA one of the early Swiss big companies was paying him. Rosalind Franklin who settle the modelling argument was funded by a big company. Over in my department we used to more or less pray that we could find 5% of the funding the Cavendish Laboratories received which would have made us rich as well. Big business runs it. Even pushing 80% of the bio food and medicines produced are by subsidiaries of the big concerns who are all connected to the agrochemical giants, so ultimately Monsanto, Bayer, Syngenta, Dow and so on pretty well control much of what we eat and use, thus market it and fund research. Product testing by independent chemists, ironically one of my old college pals left Cambridge to go into that realm to free himself from the Cavendish regime, has shown that contents/ingredients are not as precise as they 'should be', the effects of supplements overblown and research funded with expected outcomes. We simply do not know. Just take food in an average supermarket, apples on the fruit stands. Take some seeds and try to grow trees that bear fruit. The trees will grow but no fruit because they are genetically modified to produce fruit to eat not to further grow from, they will be highly susceptible to diseases and fungal infections because the parent plants were loaded with chemicals to prevent them, without they are too weak to have own defences. Citrus groves in Brazil horrified me because of the numbers of planes flying over them to spray. I know a lot of people are more or less paranoid about the food giants and their pharma friends, I am just shocked and repelled by what I have seen and heard. Those are the people also producing supplements and remedial pharmaceuticals so where do we go knowing that? Being sceptical is fine, looking for alternatives better but for all of that I still use some medication made by them because they help keep me going.

The typical measure of that is that next week I start to reduce the anti-convulsive I have been taking for three years in order to get off it. It will take two months to get off a minimal dose, require certain supplements to reduce 'withdrawal' effects and even have dietary implications. The specialist was reluctant to do it, but I used scientific arguments to state my case and asked him for advice on homoeopathic alternatives. He eventually reluctantly told me of some things including fang ji extract which is from the plant we call Stephania, one of the dozen or so plants from which curare is extracted. The ones I have are made by a subsidiary of Dow that has a name that makes it look vaguely Chinese and very 'kind of' Asiatic alternative medicine made in China, all part of the Big Placebo. Supplements are from the same companies, I'll pay through the nose for real bio produce direct or grow it myself, plenty of cow muck hereabouts instead of pharma crap... If I need a supplement, then Laphroaig produce a brilliant one.

It's really hard to find information that one can trust. There are so many people out to sell something, and we now find that the dietary advice that our govenrments have been giving us, and indeed still do, was itself based on fiddled data.

The old advice still stands though, all things in moderation, and plenty of exercise. Yes, minimise sugar, though I disagree about fat. What has been working well for me is to minimise (but not eliminate) sugar and carbs, and to eat more good fat. Another trap, of course, which are the good fats. As for canola or rape seed, I saw it recommended somewhere and we tried it, but it was not good. We didn't like the taste, it wasn't nice to cook with. Apparently it also requires processing to remove the toxic constituents, which isn't a good sign. So we rejected that in favour of coconut oil, and that is working out well.

I try to keep supplements to a minimum, but I think they have their rôle. Here too we find much conflicting advice on their benefits or not. But the test in the end will be for each of us to assess whether for us they are worth it, whether we see or feel a benefit. I can tell you that with our (also very cheap) magnesium supplementation we saw immediate benefits in reduction in migraines and night cramps. With vitamin D, I don't necessarily feel better, but I sit in an office surrounded by people sneezing and sniffling and coughing, and I rarely come down with these diseases.

I guess that many of the supplements are not effective and or very expensive, but I am attempting to avoid those. Not sure if it's a multi-billion dollar industry, but it's certainly dwarfed by the pharmaceutical industry that is now completely out of control. I was saddened but not that surprised to read recently that the former editor of the BMJ, Richard Smith, expressed the view that most of what is published in journals is just plain wrong or nonsense. So not only is it hard for Joe Soap to know what's good and bad, it's nearly impossible for those who are meant to know too.

The latest health "news" is that taking regular exercise can add 10 years to your life.
But I am with Brian on diet. Plenty of fresh fruit and raw vegetables, some meat and fish, not too much fat (because, although cholesterol is made within the body, fat is high in calories) and no added sugar is about what we evolved on before industrial foods came along.
In the 21st century, we are living longer than ever - and worrying more about our health. Supplements may do some good if you "believe" in them, but there is no scientific proof that they are needed. Like Big Pharma, the supplements and health foods industry is a multi-billion dollar business making profits for owners and shareholders.

In fact, my C intake is considered high because I eat things with it in well above average. Today I have had six mandarins, half a dozen portions of vegetables, strawberries (from my patch), cherries, tomatoes and things I have probably forgotten, probably twice the recommended need of 90-100mg. But I mix vitamin intake and really watch the omega 3 to ensure I get enough without 'overdosing', which I have done and it isn't clever. My argument is that looking at scientific reports in things ranging from the British Homoeopathic Journal through the Lancet on to far more scientific material in both domains, the arguments against high doses of any vitamin are manifold those in favour. Also, natural and supplement versions are different whereby no form of synthesis of 'natural' substances truly substitutes or improves on natural. I am healthier than when I had my heart attack and I was pretty good then, achieved by balance and self discipline and body use that is the point of those things. Otherwise they are a terrible waste that will certainly not aid our mortality as too many people believe.