A friend of mine has been hospitalised whilst on holiday in France. She has an EHIC card but her travel insurance only covered 30 days and she's been here for just over the 30 days.
She is retired in UK with a state pension and has a disability requiring a blue badge.
She is now terribly upset as the hospital have said she needs to pay 180 euro a day for each day of her hospital stay, bearing in mind she is still in hospital with breathing issues this has not helped her and she is now panicking about how this will be paid.
I know about the 80% 20% rule for most normal hospital stays (from when my mum was in hospital and thankfully had travel insurance) but I thought retired people were exempt 100%?
Can anyone help point me to any guidance which shows the rules for disabled and retired european individuals regarding hospital care in France? If I can help her by taking away the stress of the financial cost of her being in hospital I'd like to do so asap, or else she will be wanted to get out of hospital before they've fixed her as she'll be worrying about the cost of it.
One point, though, which may still be relevant, and I'm not sure if anyone mentioned. Some travel insurance companies will be flexible about how they treat a claim, especially if they end up paying less! They might consider paying all the 20% for, say, a 45-day hospitalization, rather than 100% of the 30 days for which they contracted. This would mean that the patient then pays nothing. I don't know how this is viewed by officialdom, but it might be worth asking the claims adjusters about the concept.
However if you are resident here you will also require an EHIC if you return to the UK on holiday and are unwell there. Otherwise they will register you as a UK resident with will mean you have to start over again applying for a Carte Vitale here.
Thanks everyone, I've passed on this info...really helpful many thanks x
She's out of hospital now and told the hospital to send the bill out in the post (rather than settling directly at the desk). The hospital were going to check with CPAM about what needs to be paid. Lets see!
I'm pleased for you as this will probably mean you may have access to more entitlements. However, this does not alter the fact that my mother-in-law's state pension is considerably more than £141 per week. As I have POA I received the figures for the coming year only a week or two ago. Everything she receives is allowable here in France( i.e. she does not receive Pension Credit) and everything she receives has been declared on her tax declarations here. (Not obviously yet for 2014 but for the previous years she has lived in France)She does not of course pay tax here as the reciprocal agreements on government pensions agreed by the EU means any tax she would pay, would be in the UK. Despite this therefore being zero on her Avis d'impots, her income still exceeds the other thresholds.
I realise you are trying to be helpful with your suggestions and appreciate it, but I have lived here for 15 years, read French quite well, and am fairly familiar with what is and what is not available in her circumstances. I believe our correspondence only began because I pointed out that health care for the elderly is not free of right unless the recipient has one of number of recognised illness and only becomes free with a CMU complimentaire if the persons income falls below a certain level.
I'm afraid I don't have to check her money because I have POA for her finances and I know exactly what she receives! I know you are trying to be helpful and I would love her to be able get a few 'freebies' but as I said earlier, in her case she has to pay both for her medical expenses and TV licence. I suspect her pension is more than you might have expected because of her age. Also there are several 'add on' entitlements which now all come under the state pension. Are you sure that you are only entitled to £110 ? Even my husband gets considerably more than that each week.
Thank you for your interest but yes, I have queried my mother-in-law's TV license at her Tresor Publique. The income threshold I was told was about 10,500€ per year and unfortunately her state pension alone exceeds that.
She doesn't live in our house but rents an apartment close to our local town centre so she does pay Tax d'habitaion.
I suppose I could ask again but the assistant showed me some paperwork which seemed to confirm what she was saying.
You don’t have to wait to return to UK together your reimbursement. Just take your feuilles de soins and your EHIC to your local CPAM office and they will repay to a French bank account. My sister required dental treatment and they paid her money to my account. It was very easy.
With reference to the free health care for the elderly, I'm afraid it is a means test(as for every other age group)Unfortunately my 92 year old mother-in-law does even get her TV licence because her income (which consists only of UK pension and a small occupational one) is above the threshold and she has to pay the difference for her medical costs.
Unfortunately even French nationals don't get 100% cover immediately when they retire, they still need a mutual. I am not sure of the exact age that they get it but 75 keeps popping up in my mind but I would recommend people check.
As stated your friend will have to pay the 20% and claim it back when she returns to the UK. It may be that she has not understood the bill properly.
I don't know if people remember but there was a thing about Spain last year or was it the end of 2012 where Brits were being charged for all of their healthcare even when a EHIC card was presented. The EU stepped in and told Spain that they were acting illegally and that they (the Spanish health service) were to treat them as if they were a Spanish citizen.
So based on that and what we already know anyway there is no doubt that all she has to pay is the 20%.
I can see you have been given lots of helpful advice but there is one other thing you could try doing. Speak to the admin at the hospital where she is and ask if they will 'facture' her now for her to settle the bill afterwards.Then when she gets back to the UK she can chase up the Ehic and her insurance to see if they will pay any more or at least have time to gather her finances. They may not be flexible but the twice I have been in this situation(at two different hospitals) they could not have been more helpful. If she doesn't have to worry about paying immediately, she may relax and recover more quickly.
Unfortunately I think she may definitely have to pay some of these costs but perhaps it would be a good idea not to tell her yet that there is unlikely to be an exclusion clause.
Hi Suzanne. Have you spoken to the British Embassy? They do in some case offer financial assistance but will certainly be able to tell you what to do next.
I think this one will be your nearest
Consulate of the United Kingdom in Bordeaux
ADDRESS 353 Boulevard du President Wilson 33073 Bordeaux FrancePHONELOCAL: (05) 5722.2110 INTERNATIONAL: +33.5.5722.2110FAXLOCAL: (05) 5608.3312 INTERNATIONAL: +33.5.5608.3312EMAILpostmaster.bordeaux@fco.gov.ukWEB SITEhttp://ukinfrance.fco.gov.uk/en/
hi - yes I think the 20% is the 180 - I know my mum's hospital fees 20% for 8 days was circa 2000 euros last year but she had travel insurance thankfully which covered her.
She didn't think about her insurance being only 30 days especially as retired and they had a wedding to go to in the middle of their holiday stint. I think the 20% comes as a shock as people automatically assume its same as UK. I just wanted to check if there were different rules for retired people - I know where I stand as we have CV and top up and I know our parents travel insurance which we organise is 90 days which allows them extended holidays (though won't go telling them that!).
Hi, we have just been through the same thing, firstly she has only been there 30 days. We had no insurance at all. My husband needed major spinal surgery. Her hospital bill must be around €900 a day, she is being asked to pay 20%. Each hospital is different, rural hospitals cheaper, we were transferred around, it was €864 at one, €1250 a day at Rennes. If you take ill in Paris, get out coz insurance may not pay the full bill.
English are entitled to the same as a French person. 80% on most, emergancy 100%.
But even though my husbands surgery was considered emergancy, we still paid the hospital accommodation and prescription charges for meds outside the hospital. She will have to return to the uk to claim back. We paid out €4,500, total bill around €65,000 so as you see we only paid a percentage. The rest can be claimed back in the uk, off the EU card. They post you the claim form to your house, I asked them to send it to my son’s house, whilst I was staying there while my husband recovered. you fill in the form, attach all your factures, they will want evidence you have paid them, so best to get an Attestion from the hospital before returning. Otherwise you will need bank statements. Ours is due for repayment which can take up to 90 days. As you said she is retired in the uk so she will be able to claim it all back, my husband isn’t retired so the may reduce to payment on meds, we are yet to see, but I will post the result.
No, the EU card isn’t to be used as insurance, they told us that, but you are legally entitled to claim it through the card. They would rather you claim it off your insurance company then the government pay nothing for you health care problems abroad.
Also we arrived in France 10th July, returned to England in nov for two weeks, returned to France and didn’t return to the uk till 17 feb, some 7 months later. They say you can’t claim if your over 26 weeks out of the year. Not true, we had no intention to stay, he was to ill to return, we got a letter off the surgeon to say he was to sick to return, all’s well, I know they are paying it. Will post follow up
Suzanne, did your friend intend to stay for 30 days or is she only still here because she is in hospital? If that is the case the insurance have to extend her insurance cover.
Is the 180€ the 20% or is it the total amount (I'm guessing its the 20% knowing the cost of French hospitalisation). Also, is it a public or private hospital?
The EHIC only entitles you to the same cover as people living in that country and you don't automatically get free healthcare by dint of being retired or disabled in France.