Importing a modified classic

Cars / Motoring / Insurance
21

@Porridge:

My point was that the MOT allow for significant modifications, as long as these are reported to them. My thought was that the French authorities may consider that a modified vehicle that is acceptable and recorded with the UK authorities may be therefore be acceptable in France.

Adam,

Work on the car is already well advanced, hence my desire to complete and bring with me.

From what you write, it appears that I will need to fit fog, reverse and fog lights. If these are fitted, for what reason do you feel the car would be rejected at the DREAL initial inspection?

22

I think the issue youā€™re going to come up against is that with that level of modification itā€™s not actually an MGB anymore. I think ā€œmodificationā€ might cover an upgrade to the brakes or swapping the SUs for Webbers or non standard dampers, but ripping out the engine and gearbox :thinking:

How, for example, would anybody examining that car assess if the new engine mountings were adequate, thereā€™s no manufactureā€™s (MG or Mazda) standards to compare them to. So would any engineer feel comfortable signing them off? Same with the suspension mods.

Plus, to be honest, if I was an MGB enthusiast Iā€™d want a standard one, not a messed about one.

Why not just buy a Miata here? All the fun of the B, with none of the rust :slightly_smiling_face: And I even hear their hoods a watertight.

23

Forget everything that ever happened in the UK, it carries no weight in France whatsoever and never has done.

24

I wouldnā€™t bother. From what youā€™ve written so far, thereā€™s pretty much zero chance of it ever seeing French plates

2 Likes
25

Is that a general statement on life, the universe and everything :face_with_hand_over_mouth:

26

Sorry, not for when one replies to crass statements.

Proving you do not change carburant, then engine changes, withing reason, are acceptable providing emissions are ok.

Providing shock absorbers are ok, suspension can be altered (not sure about track width) providing tyres are as specified for the car.

Bodywork can be modified providing it does not make the car larger or has dangerous projections - so minor flares and airscoops etc.

Have you ever had a single vehicle inspection done in UK or France. Unless you can build a car to the acceptable standard to be allowed by the authorities as a new car on the roads, you will fail. You should not be asking here, but on a kit car forum where the real expertise is. And maybe note/remark on why there are so few kit cars on french roadsā€¦

27

This makes me wonder how they managed it on Wheeler Dealers France, when they converted an original Fiat 500 to electric.

28

I didnā€™t see the episode. Presumably the Fiat was on a Carte Grise in France.

If it was transformed to Electric, the Carte Grise would have to be amended to note the retrofit change of power.

If it had been on CG de Collection, this would no longer be possible due to it no longer being ā€œoriginalā€ā€¦ it would change to CG (normale) with the change of power noted and the loss of benefits which Collection (classic) cars enjoy.

Incidentally, the change to electric has to be done professionally in that everything to do with the car must still work ā€œperfectly/safelyā€ despite the changeā€¦ :wink:

29

The plate was smudged out, as per usual, but it wasnā€™t black so probably not VdC, though impossible to confirm that it was a French plate.

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30

Well. Iā€™ve explained how things work for a French Reg car going ā€œelectricā€ā€¦ any other nationality would have their own rules/regulations to follow.. :+1:

31

But acceptable to who? If, as I understand from on here, you want to import a classic it needs to be original for these FFV whatever people to issue a cert which can be used, in effect, as a certificate of conformity. But who do you go to if itā€™s not original? Those Mines people (as I think they were/are called)? How are they going to assess if a car with an engine plonked in as roadworthy? Or some suspension mods are legal?

Iā€™ve seen some ropey cars at ā€œclassicā€ shows in villages around us, even beach buggies, so is it possible to mod cars with existing French registrations, or maybe not and they are illegal. Next time Iā€™ll have to ask the folk that have them how they got away with.

Have you personally got any seriously modified cars through the system? Either imports or locally modified? What was involved?

For example, if I were to change the cart springs on the back of my Morgan to coilovers does anybody need to approve it?

Or how is this legal?

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I canā€™t see anybody spending a fortune to have this assessed for road worthiness and yet it has a new reg (not the doner car reg). I would have thought cutting and rewelding a Beetle floorpan would have raised concerns with the powers that be.

32

It bears investigation on what you can and canā€™t do to a registered car in France. Iā€™m flogging our much loved and very low milage 306 convertible to a classic car garage next week. Iā€™ll find out from the horseā€™s mouth when Iā€™m there.

Maybe the latitude on a local cars is much more than on an import, or maybe the locals donā€™t care. Which is my old hobbyhorse about when in Romeā€¦ :slightly_smiling_face:

BTW, that garage has a Beach Buggy (tatty in this case) for sale too. Iā€™ll ask him for a look at itā€™s CG :slightly_smiling_face:

33

Oh a beach buggy - oh Iā€™ve longed to have a beach buggy !!

I know France isnā€™t the UK - so letā€™s not go down that route.

But as a matter of interest - do the UK authorities take such a strict line over ā€˜modifiedā€™ cars ? Iā€™m aware of the insurance aspect - but does the UK ā€˜inspectā€™ imported/modified cars in such detail as the french ?

34

Basically, to a CT tester - if one were to shove a merlin engine into an MGB, I can safely say it will not be acceptable. But a 2 litre MX5 engine into an MGB? Fine. Many abound and an easy modification.

DREAL. It will be treated as a new car to be put on the road.

as said, providing the basic dimensions of the car are not altered, you can do what you want. There are coilover kits for an MGB by the dozen and there is an IRS kit in a cassette for the rear that you would not know was installed from the outer appearance. Both mods are easy to do and take the B out of its Morris Oxford parentage.

If your Morgan is regd in France, then no one. Bring the car over with your preferred kit and I will put it on the lift and fit them for freeā€¦

I have not imported any modified cars. As said, not worth it as it is nigh on impossible. I have though imported standard cars from Japan, Germany, UK and hoping to bring in one from the US soon.

Locally modified - yes - putting EFI onto Lotus Twin Cams for others. Various MGB suspension changes, and I hope to do an engine change to a Lotus Europa if I can manage to bring in the body from the UK without its Renault engine. And my best: a 5L Buick EFI engine into an MGB - but I had to send it back to the UK, because stupidly, I did not import the base car before I started the change!

1 Like
35

Yeah, you could have left that without further comment.

36

Thanks for taking the time with a detailed response Adam. Iā€™ll email you as Iā€™ve an interesting situation to discuss :slightly_smiling_face:

37

I am really surprised that no one has ventured into making a complete IRS for the Morgans. I am sure there is room in there to do it and there must be enough willing Morgan owners to make it viable. Hoyle did it for the MGB - at a price, yes - but transformed the car quite some that had previously relied on 30s technology to take it around corners.

1 Like
38

They have. I fitted it back in 2015, but donā€™t tell anybody :shushing_face:

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SSL 5L Morgan Rear Suspension

Ride and Handling Enhancement for traditional Morgans

Our multi-link rear suspension for all traditional Morgans gives a comfortable ride with improved handling and control for touring so that everyone in the family can enjoy it.

Development

As Morgan owners and drivers ourselves we wanted to make our cars even more enjoyable to drive. We designed and perfected our SSL 5L multi-link rear suspension for all traditional Morgans.

We continue to improve the product and it now has Multi-Axis CNC machining of the aluminium alloy axle brackets, a process used for many F1 components, giving high precision, accuracy and repeatability. They also look fantastic as they are hard anodised and the steel work is black powder coated providing excellent corrosion protection.

SSL 5L system and benefits

The SSL 5L system is a bolt-on system available for both narrow and wide chassis cars and completely replaces the leaf springs. It is straightforward to install with full instructions for fitting and setup.

No drilling or welding is required for later cars and it can be fitted to earlier cars with minimal drilling.

It is fitted with tuned Spax adjustable dampers and has progressive rising spring rate and roll stiffness.

The system offers adjustable ride height, eliminates axle tramp and gives improved ride, handling and roadholding.

We recommend that it is fitted by a specialist. SSL 5L Morgan Rear Suspension

Ride and Handling Enhancement for traditional Morgans

Our multi-link rear suspension for all traditional Morgans gives a comfortable ride with improved handling and control for touring so that everyone in the family can enjoy it.

Development

As Morgan owners and drivers ourselves we wanted to make our cars even more enjoyable to drive. We designed and perfected our SSL 5L multi-link rear suspension for all traditional Morgans.

We continue to improve the product and it now has Multi-Axis CNC machining of the aluminium alloy axle brackets, a process used for many F1 components, giving high precision, accuracy and repeatability. They also look fantastic as they are hard anodised and the steel work is black powder coated providing excellent corrosion protection.

SSL 5L system and benefits

The SSL 5L system is a bolt-on system available for both narrow and wide chassis cars and completely replaces the leaf springs. It is straightforward to install with full instructions for fitting and setup.

No drilling or welding is required for later cars and it can be fitted to earlier cars with minimal drilling.

It is fitted with tuned Spax adjustable dampers and has progressive rising spring rate and roll stiffness.

The system offers adjustable ride height, eliminates axle tramp and gives improved ride, handling and roadholding.

We recommend that it is fitted by a specialist.

Hereā€™s a link to a forum discussion about fitting it to a car like mine, a limited edition Super Sport.

https://www.talkmorgan.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/788169/ssl-5l-suspension-on-a-plus-four-super-sport

I also upgraded front suspension with their kit to keep the car balanced.

39

But not properly independant - it is a five link but with a live axle.

40

True, but that wouldnā€™t be an easy or inexpensive modification. The objective is to improve on the cart springs, not go ā€œstate of the artā€.

Now, do you think that set up needs to be declared? And if so, where?

After weā€™ve sorted that we can talk about the modded inlet cam and the throttle bodies :slightly_smiling_face: