the Link which I posted is from the French Govt… talking about EU folk wanting to spend more than 3 months in France… and saying that they do NOT need a visa to do so…
Each country makes their own tweeks and rules and I would have thought that French Link over-rides anything which the EU posts as the EU is talking “generally” and France is talking specifically about it’s own country and how it wishes to treat EU folk who wish to visit…
I have tried to open the link you offered but get this…
I am an Irish citizen and Irish passport holder. I have been in France since July 2022. I do not need a visa and neither do you. If you are staying for longer than 3 months, you need to prove - by making an appointment, within 3 months, at the Prefecture of the Department you are living in - that you have accommodation, sufficient funds to support yourself and private health insurance (not travel insurance). My advice would be to go online to book the appointment as soon as you are in France (I tried to book an appointment in mid-October and could not get an appointment until the28th November). If you are on Facebook, I suggest that you join this group for very clear guidance and support:
I am also an Irish citizen and have been in France for two years, I went to my local mairie with my id docs which they copied and welcomed me to France. I have been to both Ireland and Uk without any hindrance since living here. I am registered with the tax, health and have a mutuell, so as other people have said you are a eu member come and enjoy your stay, just make sure your health / travel insurance is ample to cover your time here and you have sufficient funds to cover your Stay. I dont see any reason to worry. If you do like it here then and you want to work here you want to make sure you register here as tax resident.
I don’t even know why you are asking the question Laura Of course you can come to France (or any other EU country) without a visa and stay as long as you like, once you are not a burden on the State.
As for tax (I pay tax in France and Ireland) unless you are in France for over 180 days in any one year or 270 days in two years I wouldn’t worry about it. Though tax in France for retired people can be significantly less that in Ireland and you would be entitled to declare yourself tax resident in France from the moment you set foot here, but the hassle probably isn’t worth it for such a short period.
No, that makes no difference Rendi. It just means EU citizens going into Ireland have to present passports or their ID card and people flying from Ireland to an Schengen country the same.
You should make sure you have an EHIC card which will entitle you to the same public health cover here as a French citizen (which is far better than the cover in Ireland BTW) and decide if it’s worth getting travel cover. I never bother unless I’m going outside the EU (and UK). VHI have a good mulitrip policy.
Just for the sake of clarity, you didn’t need to do that Digi. They were probably just being nice because I’ve no idea where they’d file the document copies
Relax Laura. I’ve been here 40 years on my Irish passport and no one has ever bothered me about 90 day or 180 day rules. People of every stripe - neighbours, officials, townhall workers and police - will be so helpful and accommodating once they find out you’re Irish and not British! But as you’re unlikely to have any contact with officialdom (except at the border) then this won’t even apply. You have every right to stay as long as you like as a bona fide EU citizen … so profit from it and ignore all the scare-mongering from those less fortunate.
Are you seriously suggesting that a person can come to France to visit a friend, with no intention of staying permanently, and declare themselves tax resident if theythink it would be to their advantage?
And Ireland would agree, and stop taxing/refund any tax taken on the person’s Irish pension and other income just like that, because the person had gone on an extended holiday?
Really?
Yes Sandy, I’m not only suggesting it, it’s true Of course one wouldn’t say “I’m off on an extended holiday”, One would say “I’m moving to France” and then five months or whatever later one would say "I’ve moved back" because, in effect it is true. But as I wrote, for only five months the paperwork and hassle probably isn’t worth it. However, if there was the slightest chance of actually moving to France it would be very prudent to declare tax residency immediately and start the clock ticking on the three year Ordinarily Resident rule.
I pay my taxes in France happily because I think it is a fair system and it benefits the whole of Society . The Irish tax system takes every possible opportunity to hammer the “squeezed middle” people (unlike corporations and the very wealthy*, who all pretend to live somewhere else, Portugal, Malta, etc. ) and it is wise and prudent to pay them as little as legally possible
Edit: * except for Michael O’Leary who to his credit has remained tax resident in Ireland and payed shed loss of tax as a result.
Hi John, I followed the recomendations given by dfa.ie,Living in France - Department of Foreign Affairs, it is recomended in paragraph 2 to register with them if you want to vote in local elections - " Dual nationals who wish to exercise their right to vote on the basis of their Irish citizenship must ensure that they are registered as Irish citizens with their local town hall ( Mairie ). You can check your status on the electoral register through the Ministry of the Interior (in French). Any appeals must be made through your local Tribunal judiciaire . More information is available here." As you rightly say that it is not necessary , I just wanted to get settled into the system quickly and probably read to much into all the myriad of guidances out there.
Yes, we registered to vote too Digi. Pity that regarding national elections we’re disenfranchised, no vote here and no vote in Ireland (nor in the UK for those with dual nationality).
The Irish presidential elections might open up to the diaspora though. That might cause some interesting results. I believe there’s a guy down in Mar-a-Lago looking for a presidential gig somewhere.
An interesting reprise of residency and tax residency rules, these being two different things. I’d like to make two comments on tax residency,
the first being that determining which country comes down a lot to intention e.g. I moved to France 2020 with the intention of exercising EU residency rights to gain coverage under the WA. That presumably makes my centre of personal interests France. But all the financial interests is still UK - including work.
and so to the second point - I should - (but there was Covid lockdown) spend most of my time in the UK, so certainly shouldn’t be in France 183 days / year, yet I still remain France taxable (hooray).
All down to intention I suspect. If the OP has no intention of becoming France tax resident then that would be the overriding consideration - on the other hand if they then change their mind / decide to do so, their France tax liability will begin the day they decide to do so, and presumably the Irish tax liabilities become subject to the France / Ireland tax treaty on that day too?
Well this is what I find hard to swallow, because to me there are many big differences between going on holiday and moving house. (Change your car reg, contact your bank, your pension provider, move your possessions, etc.) In this case the lady has been invited to stay with a friend and there seems to be no question of this being a permanent arrangement.
If you say you are doing the one, when in fact you know perfectly well you are doing the other, then I see that as Boris Johnson’s type of truth.
Of course you can come to France (or any other EU country) without a visa and stay as long as you like, once you are not a burden on the State.
