Jeremy Corbyn will stand down if Labour loses next election

Politics
61

Which is all fair enough.

Like almost everyone I was at most dimly aware of Corbyn prior to his becoming leader of the Labour party but, at that point, one only had to look at his record as an MP - defying the whip 100’s of times, never contributing as a legislator or select committee member to wonder what sort of leader he would become.

Later on his affiliations with what most would recognise as terrorist organisations became apparent and, whatever hair splinting you wish to apply, you have to admit that they don’t look good for the leader of the country’s 2nd political party. As bad in many ways as the Tory ties to wealthy individuals and hedge funds.

He defines himself as a rebel - which is OK when you have an establishment to rebel against. It doesn’t always work out when you become the establishment and you try to rebel against yourself.

As I said above - the role of the opposition is to try to hold the government of the day to account. It can be difficult for an opposition to make much headway when the incumbent party has a large majority but we had a minority government, governing only with the grace of a supply & confidence agreement with the DUP and a significant minority of the country who’s views were increasingly ignored by the Tories.

As far as I can see the Labour party had a clear responsibility to champion the 48% and, largely because of Corbyn, it has singly failed in that responsibility.

So, when I say I’m not a fan - it is not about his IRA affections, or support for Hezbollah (though neither endear him to me) - it is about the role he has played in the Brexit induced damage that has been done, and continues to be done, to the UK.

And the evidence for that is plain.

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62

You are forgetting to mention the Tory party’s involvement in the atrocities in Yemen. The sale of arms to Saudi Arabia. This casts a dialogue with Sinn Fein or the IRA IN SUPPORT OF PEACE in Northern Ireland in rather a different light doesn’t it?

This suggests that those Brexit voters who do not support the Tories should not have a voice. I didn’t agree with the current Labour party approach for a long time but now it appears to be the only glimmer of hope to bring the two opposing sides of Brexit and Remain together again.

Labour are proposing a second referendum. It is hard to keep up but I don’t think the Lib Dems are any more?

I have said all of this and it might sound like I am picking an argument with you. I am not. I do think Labour would do better under a different leader. Rightly or wrongly Jeremy Corbyn is as divisive as Brexit is.

I do think the press and the media have an enormous amount to answer for. Their portrayal of Corbyn (which has been atrocious) is only the tip of the iceberg . There has been a staggering failure of reporting on Brexit and what it means for the country. This travesty continues to be perpetuated on a daily basis and we will continue to suffer for it.

We could have a whole conversation about populism and who could do a better job but what I think it boils down to is that in reality you sometimes have to vote for the least bad option whilst hoping that a better one will come along!

63

2x wrong != 1x right

International politics is a murky business though, it always taints the participants.

Not really - you ned to appreciate that there are different roles when campaigning, governing and opposing. There also are - or at any rate should be but everything has been subsumed by Brexit - different axes depending on the issue at hand.

The big problem is not that “Labour Leavers” have no voice, but that we now need four parties to represent everyone (Leave/Remain vs Left/Right - and perhaps even a 5th for centrist remainers; I’m assuming that there aren’t many centrist Leavers) but the party split does not reflect the division of opinion - hence the current mess.

LD now saying they will revoke were they to win a majority or (I think) support a referendum if not.

+1

+several

BBC in particular just allow politicians to get away with inaccuracies, vague statements and outright lies without being challenged. We could have done with more reporting which forced them to justifyu what they were saying (like the Al Jazeera thing with Richard Tice).

Sad, but true.

64

The Labour Party us a democratic institution based on egalitarianism and consultative decision-making

:smiley: Shall we have a show of hands to see if we agree?

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65

Interesting blast from the past of the “man of principle”

66

Corbyn’s thousands of supporters, who blindly see no wrong in him, believe they have one last defence: that he took the party to the brink of victory in the 2017 General Election and brought it hundreds of thousands of new members.

To them, the short answer is: No, he didn’t.

After the calamities of David Cameron’s last years in office and austerity, the Labour Party should have won that ballot by a landslide.

As anyone who canvassed for Labour two years ago will tell you, again and again on the doorstep people said: ‘I’m not voting for Jeremy Corbyn.’

He was the real reason Labour didn’t win.

True, thousands of young voters rallied to him. But they won’t do it again: there were no chants of ‘Oh, Jeremy Corbyn’ at Glastonbury, as there were two years ago.

And the party is still stuck with a rag-bag of ex-Communists, Trotskyists, militants — including in Corbyn’s office. All ‘flat Earthers’, politically speaking.

Any other opposition in history would have been a mile ahead of the Government, given the multitude of rows, splits and resignations Theresa May faced as her premiership stumbled to its ignominious end. But in most polls, Labour still languishes behind the hopeless Tories.

The Tories are now doing something about their position: they have a new leader. So have the Lib Dems, finally ridding themselves of the last vestiges of the leadership that promised to abolish tuition fees before the 2010 election and then helped to triple them in coalition with David Cameron’s Conservatives.

Now it is Labour’s turn.

If Corbyn won’t go of his own free will, he should be forced out by his MPs. It can be done, despite the fact that they have tried and failed before.

The way there is long if the will can be found. If it isn’t, then God help our country.

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