Trying to get my head around the use of the UK S1. My husband received his state pension in 2022 and an S1 form which we duly sent into the CPAM and we use box 8SH on the declaration for his pension income. In 2023 I also started to receive my UK state pension. I requested an S1 which was duly sent to me. However, I have been self employed in France for 6 years until 2020. UK pension office still sent me an S1 even though they must have known about my self employment in France. So, my predicament is whether to present my S1 to the CPAM and avoid social chargesâŠor whether I am not actually allowed to do this because I have 6 years of working in France, and maybe a small French pension may ensue. However, have read somewhere on the internet, if the UK is the main provider of your pension, which it is, as I have 35 years of National Insurance contributions, then UK is liable via my S1 for my healthcare. So, should I submit my S1 or not?
The rules are based on the last place you worked, so your competent state is now France. It no longer has anything to do with having accrued a bigger pension in one place or another (if it ever did, I think that may be a myth).
So you are not eligible for an S1. The form/process to request one does ask about employment and unless you told DWP this explicitly then they would not know. Or they could have âknownâ but still issued it automatically without any human reflection.
In theory if you present this S1 to CPAM they will reject it. Again there is a high possibility that they will accept it initially, and only a year or so down the line will they realise the mistake when they finally get round to interrogating your record, or the Uk finally gets round to answering their questions.
So, up to you.
Thanks Jane for the information. The S1 form was issued to me as a result of a verbal conversation with UK government staff, in which no one asked if I had worked in France. The reason I felt the pension office might have known is that I bought back 6 missing years of my national insurance record based entirely on my self employment in France, so I assumed they would have this on my records. Further, the CPAM actually requested an S1 form from me last year, even though my records at USAAF will show that I was self employed for those 6 years. The reason I am in a bit of dilemma is that I am honestly not sure if I will actually get any sort of French pension, as I believe if you have contributed less than 10 years, you are not entitled. So, thatâs why I am not sure what to do. Naturally, I want to do the right thing.
Shows you the amounts needed for an AE to âqualifyâ - it varies by what your registered as. They send me a letter every year saying how many trimesters I have.
Itâs trimestres, not years, that count. You can get an estimate.
Hi Jane. Yes, I have 24 trimestres, so 6 years. I have received an estimate, but not sure if this is a sure-fire thing that I will actually by paid, as I have read on numerous sites that you need a minimum of 10 years.
I think it is 10 trimestres!
Whatever it is, and I am no expert on this, but can only tell you of my own experience.
I worked in France for 3 years for an employer as soon as I arrived here permanently.
I also did a small job for a neighbour for which I was paid by cheque lâemploi.
I was advised of my pension at a local meeting and, because I mentioned I might do casual work for my last employer, if I did not claim the pension straght away, it would be enhanced when I did so.
I didnât do any casual work in the next year so then claimed my pension and was very surprised to see that it was much more than the estimate I was given.
On top of that I was told of an industry pension from Carcept. So I claimed that and was given a breakdown of the sources, my original employer and the âŹ100 job I did for the neighbour.
So, although I was never self employed, there was no question of a 10 year wait, just my age at the time I retired, 60, and the number of trimestres which I had accrued over my working life.
I have never had an S1 and the only involvement with one was my wifeâs.
Curious, was an S1 not also issued to you as a âfamily memberâ at that time? Or did you decide not to request one because 2023 was quite near and you didnât want to complicate things?
And presume you didnât do any work in the UK between 2020 and now - e.g. no UK self employment? You do have to register as self employed in the UK if only to pay the NI Class 2 voluntary contributions to credit your Uk pension record whilst working abroad.
You never know, these credits may even, in the eyes of theEU social coordination rules, count as âemploymentâ.
Edit - I donât think itâs likely but you might want to research it?
Hi. My husbandâs S1 didnât invite a family member, and I didnât pursue it, as I know the CPAM are not keen to have people piggy backing on their partners health care. They prefer individual accounts. So I left it and waited for my S1 to arrive in 2023.
I didnât work in the UK or anywhere between 2020 and now. I live permanently in France. To make up my 35 years of UK national insurance, I paid voluntary Class 2 contributions for the same 6 years I was paying French social security cotisations. So, as you suggest, this in fact may make me equally responsible for by the UK government, and thereby justifying presenting my S1. Itâs a thought.
By all means try, but donât buy a yacht in anticipation! Voluntary contributions means just that, so really think that the powers that be will be alert to this wrinkle.
But a shame you didnât use your husbandâs S1 for a period. They donât offer it, you have to ask to become a beneficiary. But as soon as I hit pension age it was cancelled! It is standard. Very different from the Ayant Droit scheme that used to exist here, and from CPAMs point of view they like it as means UK pays for both people not just one!
My wife is piggybacked on my S1 and has been so since our arrival in France almost 6 years ago.
Initially she did not have her own CPAM account, however when she reached UK retirement ago CPAM created an account for her.
Although my wife reached UK pension age a couple of years ago, she is still piggybacked on my S1 as she has not yet claimed her UK pension.
Hi,
Out of interest, has your wife tried to get an EHIC card issued by the UK? Iâm in the same situation and they wonât issue me one. They claim I have applied for an S1( at 55?) and the application is on hold. Any experience of this?
My wife and I both have EHIC cards issued by the NHS.
We were both here pre-Brexit which may have some bearing upon this issue.