Six month visa expires 31st August 2022. Would we need to return to UK and then comeback on Schengan for 90 days or can we stay in France and it automatically transfers over?
Might be an idea to check any paperwork/emails you received concerning your Application and the site you used to obtain the Visa in the first place…
On what grounds did you obtain your Visa ???
(From what I’ve read… Visas don’t “automatically transfer”.)
Simple non working visitors Visa. We have taken early retirement and fortunately self sufficient. Even if we have to return to UK, it is not a major issue as it was never our intention to stay here in August, too hot and busy. Interested to know the official line though, as no mention on paperwork just expiry date.
Be a bit careful because if you have spent 6 months solid in France during 2002 and you are planning on spending more months here, questions of fiscal residency could arise.
2 Likes
In general you cannot change your visa status in-country. So I think this would be frowned on and considered as an overstay (which you don’t want on your record!!).
Logically this makes sense with Schengen visa waiver conditions as you can only be in a country 90 days in 180 on rolling basis. So if you have already been here 90 days you have to leave for 90 days to be eligible for the Schengen visa again.
Valid point Sandcastle, need to research that more but as not earning anything in France would assume it will be a nil return. Guess HMRC might be a seperate arguement
One must make a Declaration of Worldwide Income (from every source), all Bank accounts etc etc to the French Tax folk… a year in arrears.
The fact that one is not physically working/earning in France is immaterial.
Yes but the return will be zero, and overseas income will be whatever our income is in the UK and will be declared but not taxed in France provided we attach our self assessment UK wise.
Kinda of getting away from my original post re visa and schengen. All I was asking is do you need to go back to UK before Schengen kicks in
Not necessarily. For instance if you receive a UK state pension and you are deemed resident in France, your UK state pension is taxable in France not in the UK. As is savings and investment income. This is as per the France-UK tax treaty.
Agreed, it is not your question, but it may be important to understand how tax works.
1 Like
I suspect we are at cross purposes… I was pointing out that one’s Return will total whatever is one’s Worldwide Income… thus it won’t be zero.
and, of course, whilst there is an arrangement to avoid double taxation per se … any investment/rental/whatever income does attract quite stiff Social Charges here in France.
and, yes, I know we’ve wandered off the path of your original question, but I feel it’s worth pointing out at least one of the possible consequences of staying too long in France…
2 Likes
Good point re the tax situation, as once you cross that 6 month barrier it gets very difficult, and now UK folks will find it difficult as entry and departure from the country is formally registered. I can imagine the French authorities will be ready to pounce!
1 Like
Fully understand Letsmile. Must keep wits about me. Thinking matters through dont think we will get to 6 months tbh.
Thanks to all the feedback
OK, this was a long post which it turns out is largely bollox - thanks to Jane for making me look just deeply enough to realise I have several things completely wrong about dual taxation, so I’ll shut up, except for my closing comment which was:
This tax stuff is complicated - until you have to deal with two countries’ tax systems - at which point the complexity quadruples 
1 Like
Perhaps you are mixing up state and public sector pensions?
OH receives his UK state pension gross. He pays no tax on it in the UK, and it is declared and taxed here in France. (Same with a private pension)
I have a government pension. It is taxed in the UK, and declared here where I get credit for tax already paid.
We do not pay social charges on any of them, just the 7.5% prélèvement solidaire.
If you have enough savings (there is a minimum threshold) you could look at Sterling Assurance Vie. Fully compliant with French regulations and tax efficient. Also bypasses French inheritance issues.
Not exactly but I assumed UK income would be taxed in the UK which is not quite the case. State pension is paid gross, private pensions generally tax deducted but you can take 25% tax free. The result if you have UK state and company/private pension is (presumably) that you will automatically pay some tax in the UK - which you can then declare to the fisc. There are elements of my understanding which were OK but some which were well off.
I will need to get my head around this properly - but I have a few years yet to sort it out.
I don’t mind being wrong - useful discussion to force me to check my understanding against reality (and research reality a bit more). It doesn’t change my basic view that I will need to think carefully whether I become French tax resident.
It will depends on interest rates and costs (but doesn’t everything).
What you are overlooking is that as a French resident you request that they are paid gross.
We pay less tax in France that we would were we UK residents. Surprised us, but with various nits and pieces it is possible.
But even if you don’t the tax paid can be declared in France and taken into account, I presume?
I guess so, but why would you? As above, we pay less tax here.
Depends on income - I think the French 30% band kicks in before the UK 40% so between 26,070€ and £50,270 you’d pay 20% in the UK and 30% in France.
Plus, as a pensioner you pay no NI in the UK, but you *do* pay social charges in France.
Reading the relevant sections of the UK-FR dual tax treaty will help you understand I think.
Some parts of the treaty are indigestible but the parts about personal taxation, where pensions, employment income etc are taxed are quite straightforward and once you have read that I think it will seem a lot less complicated. There are rules which tax authorities and taxpayers have to follow. It is like a lot of things, confusing until you find out the rules.