We have Assurance Vies with LMEP in Luxembourg, and we have held them for well over 8 years. Tax and social charges on withdrawals are deducted at source by LMEP, and when we make withdrawals, we tick box “IRPP”, not “PL”.
We have declared S1 forms, and tick 8SH and 2OP.
First question is … which box, or boxes, do we complete with the gain element of these withdrawals?! I ticked 2BH, but since have thought 2CH is the correct box. Am I right?
When I went to update our tax returns, an unexpected note appeared, that hadn’t when I completed our forms back in June.
So this is my second query, regarding our pensions. This is the note:
“Vous avez perçu des pensions de source étrangère déclarées en 1AM et/ou 1BM. Si vous êtes affilié à un régime d’assurance maladie français, n’oubliez pas de remplir les rubriques 8TV, 8QV, 8TH, 8QX selon le taux de CSG applicable à votre situation. Pour connaître la ou les rubriques à renseigner en fonction du taux de CSG applicable, vous pouvez vous reporter à l’imprimé n° 2041 GG disponible sur impots.gouv.fr”
We both have (UK) state pensions, plus J’s is Civil Service, ticked boxes 1AL & 1AM, and mine employment, ticked box 1AM. We are both in the French health system, with Cartes Vitales. I’ve looked at 2041 GG, which I found utterly unhelpful. Which of 8TV, 8QV, 8TH and/or 8QX should we each tick?
You should also tick box 8SI (as both of you have S1s) as well as 8SH. I wonder if that is what has generated the unexpected note with reference to 8TV/8QU etc etc?
As I’m sure you already know, 20P is the box to have your investment income/gains etc liable to normal marginal income tax rates - rather than the fixed 12.8% flat tax (and 17.2% social charges rate). Is this intentional?
On gains from AV I would expect your Luxembourg provider to supply you with full details on what you report, given the complexity that surrounds reporting AV gains eg whether pre or post 2017 investments, and whether you have gains liable at 7.5% or 12.8%, depending on the size of your AV investment (more or less than €150k). Have you asked your Luxembourg provider for guidance as to what you should report and where? I would definitely expect my AV providers to do just that, and indeed have just checked their websites which confirm this is part of their responsibilities.
Hi, Many thanks for your reply. I’m not seeing 8SI as an option to tick. “Searching” for it states that is only on return 2042C, which presumably isn’t the return we have.
Unfortunately our AVs are with LMEP; their customer service is appalling beyond belief. They just take charges and provide nothing in return. Our financial advisers boast tax specialists, yet state they are not qualified to assist with completing tax returns! Our investments are all pre-2017, and both exceed €150k. Hope this helps.
8SI does indeed appear on 2042C .I’m not sure if you’re doing your return online or on paper. Online the box should presumably appear automatically. If you’re doing paper version, why not print off 2042C and tick the appropriate box?
I would make reference to this in ‘messages expresses’ box (where you can make comments) IF you can’t access the box either online or in paper form.
You’v clearly been placed in an impossible position by your AV provider. Have you specifically asked them if they will provide an IFU or equivalent (the standard French tax form from providers advising what figures go in which box) - it seems an abdication of responsibility on their part. If they will not help, I would consider telling them you will file a very negative opinion on Trust Pilot and other feedback websites. That might encourage them to help. Failing that, you can always make another comment on messages expresses (see above) explaining the problem with your Luxembourg providers refusal to issue an IFU or equivalent and set out why you’ve reported the AV gains in box 2 BH in good faith. Provide as much information as possible on the dates you paid the premiums into your AV, the balances being in excess of €150k etc.
It would be interesting to hear from others on SF who have non French AV providers. In particular if you’ve taken withdrawals, did your provider issue any form of guidance for reporting the amounts paid out, whether as an IFU, or a generic form? Of course it’s possible that nobody has actually taken withdrawals…
When I was client facing, I occasionally reviewed step by step guidance for tax return reporting purposes, issued to the recipients of certain global incentive plans on behalf of their employers. Guidance would typically be produced for all the main countries where people had to file tax returns. It is not difficult to produce and responsible employers generally did so.
I have an AV administered in Luxembourg by Utmost (Formerly Lombard International). They issue an annual statement and this year i withdrew some of the fund and that resulted in a seperate document detailing the withdrawal and the relevant amount that would need to be declared to the tax authority.
Thanks Peter. Out of interest was this document sufficiently detailed to enable you to know where and how to report the withdrawal on your French return, or was it simply telling you the amounts, leaving you to work out how to actually report it?
Regarding LMEP, we receive our end of year valuations in March, which demonstrates the level of consideration they give their unfortunate clients. This does include a page detailing the withdrawals over the year, but no guidance as to where and how to detail the figures on tax returns.