Why, if you live in France, did you vote for Brexit?


(Elaine Hayden) #283

Everytime I see the unelected argument I think daily mail reader :

How sad that people have to be labelled in this way and such an idiotic assumption. Guardian reader, Daily Mail reader rather than accepting that everyone is entitled to their own opinion no matter what paper they read - - a choice of newspaper does not define who that person is so I do wish people would stop using this term to simply attempt to dismiss, deride another person’s opinion …usually when they don’t like or agree with what that person is saying. I do not read any UK newspapers so object when someone tries to compartmentalise me by using these lazy, idiotic labels. It seems to be a British obsession. I do wonder if this discussion would still be going on had the Brexit vote gone the other way? I doubt it somehow.

(Martin Cooper) #285

So using your argument Stella, giving the populus the right to choose a Head of State, is too dangerous in a democracy ?

So using your argument, you would agree the 37% of the people who voted for the advisory referendum, should be ‘patted on the back and told to and lie down while we ignore you’?

I can live with that logic… :slight_smile:

(anon71231711) #286

What concerns me is that so many people didn’t vote, and in many cases I’m sure this was because they didn’t feel they knew enough about the issues to make the decision. A lot of people who did vote, basically voted on gut feeling. Is that really how decisions should be made? I don’t blame them, I blame the heads of state for not putting out clear facts and figures in an impartial manner.

(Martin Cooper) #287

Hi Tim,

Would rather have a system which allowed a true representation of our vote, than FPTP. Yes, this would allowed UKIP a number of MP’S in our Parliament, but that a price worth paying as than we might not have this right wing, listless Gov we have now which 56% of the peeps did not vote for.

You are correct, Liz is powerless but gives more unwritten powers to the PM, than if we had a true democratic, written consistution, without having an unelected ‘Family’ representing us…

Read that last sentence again everyone, an unelected Family representing us, just because they were BORN to that Position …

Then people claim the EU is undemocratic… :slight_smile:


(stella wood) #288


Hi Martin

I offered no argument…so don’t try and draw me into that scenario…:scream:

I merely mentioned something that I thought needed to be said… :innocent:

(Martin Cooper) #289

… And I’m merely and humbly mentioned a counter reply… :slight_smile:

(Manon kit) #290

Carpe dieum

(Manon kit) #291

At the forefront
Don’t be afraid Martin.
I know everything will be okay in the end.
Have faith.

(Timothy Cole) #292

I was in the US when the election occurred last November and after the result I asked countless people why they voted for Trump, the answer was always ‘anyone but Clinton’. Electing a head of state sounds fine in principle providing you have decent candidates, at least you know what you’re getting with the Royals and they can’t do the country much harm.

I’ve always thought that coalition governments are the way to run a country but under PR I’m not sure that would work every time.

(Martin Cooper) #293

Hi Tim,

Having someone born into a job, is wrong on so many issues. Might work ok if it’s ‘Liz’ but you never know what the genetic lottery will come up with next.

In someways, it’s down to us, the voters to be more educated who we vote for (in my ideal system) and also maybe down to the Gov to maybe invest in civic education on the responsibility of voting and the history of Gov (good & bad)

I think in PR we will have more chance of coaliation Gov. Hopefully that will mean longer term thinking of our Country’s future, than short term election success (by individual parties)



(David Martin) #294

Do you think that France is heading for PR?

(Martin Cooper) #296

Hi David,

I asked that question to my french OH. She stared back at me with disinterest and shrugged her shoulders and said “non” :slight_smile:

However, at least the French system is better than the UK’s FPTP, which you can be more tatic with your vote ( unlike my UK constituency, where my vote is wasted against the sitting MP - Chesham - Cheryl Gillan)


(Timothy Cole) #297

We live in an imperfect world Martin and at the moment ditching the Royals to become a republic (or whatever) should be way down on the list of priorities. I’m hoping that the surge in the youth vote in June shows that the under 25’s are becoming interested in politics generally although the cynic in me thinks it was more down to the charisma of Corbyn and the promise of the abolition of tuition fees etc.

(Martin Cooper) #298

Agreed Tim,

Also on my list of priorities leaving the EU would be at my personal bottom. Would make my inperfect world, slightly better :slight_smile:


(Peter Juselius) #299

Do the House of Lords function well? Do they bring advantages to the Political System?

(Robert Hodge) #300

I think that the House of Lords does bring a certain breadth of knowledge and expertise into the evaluation of proposed legislation. Probably the Hereditary Peers should be removed and be replaced with more Life Peers who would be actually willing to regularly attend and contribute to the process of government. The one advantage that the Lords have is that they are not concerned with being re-elected and so can say what they believe to be right, rather than what is popular with the electorate.

(Richard Perou) #301

I am sorry that you are so misinformed. I sincerely hope that you don’t live to regret it.
However it would help me in my misunderstanding if you would quote the evidence for

Forced entry into Euro zone.
Legislation to create a EU funded army.
Laws enforcing unlimited immigration of EU citizens.
Evidence that elections in the EU are some how rigged.

Since starting this response I note that others have asked the same question… If I find your response then let’s leave it there.

Otherwise it would seem that you are either foolish or are having problems with the truth.

(Richard Perou) #302

Nice try but no cigar.

Now give evidence not opinion.

(Margaret Schooling) #303

“So I think these are valid question to ask anyone who lives in the UK but not to ask anyone who lives abroad.” But the EU isn’t (not yet anyway) “abroad” in the usual sense of the word. We are EU citizens. I, for one, was able to come to France to live and work while, at the same time, maintaining everything British about me If I chose, or if necessary, I could return to the UK. I don’t understand the difference you see here. The EU expanded my rights and I’m not aware that they were ever diminished by the EU.

(Margaret Schooling) #304

This is an interesting recap - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kgu6pFz5oxA