Believe whatever you want to believe, check available scientific evidence before accepting nonsense as fact!

I think of it as an infection. Maybe. Or a breakable habit if not a treatable ailment. Maybe most of the people alive now, have been raised from infancy, being pacified by bits of brightly wrapped trash.
The baby’s crying?
Give him some more plastic.
He neeeeeds plastic!!!:fearful:.

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/your-kids-toys-are-killing-the-planet_n_58ffa383e4b0f5463a1a9472?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAEJDY63qIqm42MkUkv8ttkv5xCwDhArRv422JSR2sGWnUnV4rDWdbAyoOkZ3ugWvPjMpVJxZQBeVcR0oajgb4r4j1AH5JDoUWEUBqJleMVNxsglcU2jUgA85cOG6-_vsdsK_fUoOAE0gBi-TIh9wrPPtIaAMKAeWpz__5VrrcAyK

And now for some good news. One of Britain’s and Northern Europe’s rarest and most elusive mammals has been discovered living in the East of England for the first time in 115 years.

Revealing this happy development, the Guardian said: ‘The return to Kent of the greater horseshoe bat has delighted and astounded conservationists.’

But what is the reason for the unexpected return of this creature with its ‘distinctive, alien-like ultrasonic warbling signals’? According to a spokesman for the Bat Conversation Trust, it seems possible that ‘the species is now able to expand its range into Kent due to climate changes’.

But isn’t climate change meant to be an ecological disaster for every living thing on the planet? That’s the Guardian’s usual line, and it is definitely the view of the eco-protest group known as Extinction Rebellion, which launched its ‘mass-disruption’ in our capital city as part of its attempt to bully politicians to make the UK ‘net carbon zero by 2025’.

Actually, I wonder why they bother, since the co-founder and leader of Extinction Rebellion, Roger Hallam, told the Sunday Times: ‘We’re all going to be dead soon, so there’s nothing else to do.’

In like spirit, the 16-year-old Swedish schoolgirl Greta Thunberg declares that unless we immediately switch to a form of existence not seen since before the Industrial Revolution, she and others of her age will not grow up to have children of their own because Earth will very soon be an uninhabitable furnace.

The same approach is championed in America by the no less charismatic 29-year-old Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, who declaims: ‘The world is going to end in 12 years’ — not 11 or 13 years, she’s most precise — ‘if we don’t address climate change.’

The only problem with this is that it isn’t true. Not remotely so. What is true is that if, in line with Hallam’s demands, we revert to what he enthusiastically describes as ‘a peasant orientation which obviously has been completely lost in Western society’, we will indeed witness a shortening of life expectancy and even the prospect of mass starvation (we might have to beg for food aid from rapidly industrialising China).

But what about our friends in the animal kingdom? Are they truly at imminent threat of global wipe-out as a result of the CO2 we emit?

Despite Extinction Rebellion’s message, the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change — the UN body guided by the scientists in the field — says nothing of the kind. Its most recent report declares: ‘Overall, there is very low confidence that observed species extinctions can be attributed to recent climate warming, owing to the very low fraction of global extinctions that have been ascribed to climate change and the tenuous nature of most [such] attributions.’

Greener

In terms of the future, having modelled the effect of anticipated global increases in CO2 emissions from rapidly growing economies of the most populous nations, the IPCC states: ‘There is low agreement concerning the fraction of species at increased risk . . . and the timeframe over which extinctions could occur.’

But what’s the story to date? What you won’t hear so much about is that a certain amount of warming is, on balance, a good thing for species, including humans.

As a result partly of man-made CO2 emissions, Earth has actually become greener. Dr Ranga Myneni of Boston University has demonstrated by analysing data from satellite images of the planet, that 31 per cent of the global vegetated surface of the Earth has become greener over the past three decades, and only 3 per cent has become less green. It’s not called the ‘greenhouse effect’ for nothing.

But what about Africa, said to be the biggest likely victim of climate change?

While increased temperatures might save tens of thousands of lives a year in Northern Europe, where cold bears off so many mostly elderly people in winter, they are less likely to be a boon nearer the Equator. Yet it turns out those satellite images have also shown a marked greening in dry areas such as the Sahel in Africa.

As best-selling science writer Dr Matt Ridley observed: ‘The decline of famines in the Sahel in recent years is partly due to more rainfall caused by moderate warming and partly due to more carbon dioxide itself: more greenery for goats to eat means more greenery left over for gazelles, so entire ecosytems have benefited.’

Perverse

The key fact to bear in mind is that CO2 is not, in itself, a pollutant; nor detrimental to the air we breathe. The problem for us is the sooty particulates that come out of the exhaust of vehicles powered by internal combustion engines. They really do kill.

Diesel engines produce far more of these dangerous emissions than petrol ones — yet because of the fixation with ‘man-made climate change’, the British government massively incentivised, through the tax system, a switch to diesel from petrol because the latter produced more CO2 per unit of energy.

What a perverse, self-annihilating strategy, though I don’t delude myself that it will ‘help save the planet’.

Of course, the Extinction Rebellion demonstrators are against all forms of motorised transport; indeed, every modern form of travel. As even a reasonably supportive article in the New Internationalist explained, under the policies of Extinction Rebellion: ‘Energy would be strictly rationed, dedicated to survival . . . expect massive disruption in the way food is grown, processed and distributed . . . there would be virtually no private car use, aviation, haulage or shipping.’

By supporting ER, we would be living in an eco-fascist dystopia. .

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Roger C - What an excellent post - really, really good. We all need to be far more analytical about what is being ‘preached’ understand that the scientists are divided, and that computer forecasts are only as good as the info fed in. (Wasn’t there an acronym for that?).

In today’s papers there are articles re a scientific study - which suggests that over-population is the main cause of pollution, and that this is a problem which is not really being addressed; guess why - religion… Every time I’ve tried to mention this, especially in the Guardian, I get the usual childish ‘killing babies, or cull old people’ - when it is nothing of the sort. So I stopped pointing out the problem.

I think most of us would like to lead lives that don’t harm our family, our community, our planet…
We can try, we can recycyle, we can buy from jumble sales and charity shops and not buy new clothes (which I have done, and still do - my poor daughter spent most of her childhood in ‘stuff’ from jumble sales - thankfully she doesn’t seem traumatised by her deprived childhood !!) I’ve also been a vegetarian for more than 40 years…

Sadly though most of the XR lot don’t really understand the science, have been persuaded into the latest fashionable cause - and are so ‘snowflaked’ that any critical thinking seems to have been abandoned. Global warming/climate change has become a cult - a religion for the faithless, natched with a philosophy for the brainless, and science for the innumerate. Some scientists believe that in 20 or 30 years time the world faces a Little Ice Age - so solar panels won’t be much use, and with less wind - the turbines won’t be much use either.
I’d say follow the money; see the grants, where they are going, Look at the facts about the costs involved in materials etc in producing solar panels, and wind farms…
We have progressed so far down the line of today’s society being so reliant on computers and technology that ‘turning everything off’ is no longer possible. But look at modern science; there is so much we use today which has been discovered, invented over the last 30 years. I have great faith in technology (sorry) - and even greater faith in young scientists, researchers, developers to ‘discover’ long-life batteries, microbes to destroy plastics etc etc.

We can all do our little bit, but I’m afraid the XR lot aren’t helping.
Member of my family went ‘off grid’ for a few years; she didn’t work, grew her own veggies etc etc; she gave up after 5 years - but she didn’t work - she wasn’t in employment. Guess what - the poor hard-working Joe Bloggs polluting the planet was the guy paying her Unemployment Benefit.
I hate plastic; but I buy meat in supermarkets - coverd in plastic. Maybe the supermarkets need to do more. But if we stopped using plastic what happens to all those Chinese workers with jobs producing the stuff, and making more stuff out of plastic - no jobs for them, back to living in rural China ? How to tell them they are back to poverty again because the West doesn’t want their plastic ? It is a real dilemma, I don’t want to hurt people’s standard of living and future opportunities for their children…
You see, I do understand both sides of the argument - and I don’t want to start a war of words.

Yes, there are problems; no, we can’t solve it by going ‘off grid’, and the XR lot are hypocrites who don’t have the answer, except for implying that those who haven’t led such an affluent lifestyle with private planes and luxury holidays need to go back and live in the Dark Ages. No sign of many of the Z list celebs doing that is there ?
We can all do what little bit we can, but I don’t kid myself that in the grand order and scheme of things it will make a big difference.

PS - how many of you use wood burning stoves.? You’re killing a living organism, cut a tree down, burn it up, pollute the air with smoke…? !! Sorry, I know it’s the fash to have a wood-burner - but we don’t have one; hate the thought of burning wood of any kind - poor trees - hosts to insect life, and givers of oxygen. how could you all do it !

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We’ve got four wood burners in total and burn a mix of compressed wood buches, scrap wood and trees/branches from our garden and others that we work at, this means our electric heating usage is very low which surely is good for the environment.

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I watched this today… :slightly_smiling_face:

And then there’s this petition here signed by 31,487 scientists…to put this into perspective the UN has only 600 scientists signed up to “global warming”…

http://petitionproject.org/

And talking of hamsters…just when you think you’ve got the hang of something…:grinning:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mt084vYqbnY

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There have been several efforts to compile lists of dissenting scientists, including a 2008 US senate minority report,[[13]]
This is an ongoing effort to discredit climatologists…
Mr trump would love it.

(https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_scientists_who_disagree_with_the_scientific_consensus_on_global_warming#cite_note-13) the Oregon Petition,[14] and a 2007 list by the Heartland Institute,[15] all three of which have been criticized on a number of grounds.[16][17][18]

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Hi Jeanette :wave:t3:,
Glad to see you can still post, what’s with the new look? :open_mouth:

Hi Tracey - I might be wrong, l often am, but l think the Anon 7836490 means Jeanette has either decided to leave of her own free will or has been banned. I think that following Peter Goble’s demission she has decided to find pastures new - but as l say, l could be wrong - What do you think?

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Not sure now, avatar says suspended but able to post? Must be self imposed.
Dropping like flies comes to mind … :hushed:

PS are we supposed to ask that they give their full name or will a member of the team do that? :confused:
Nevermind - I guess it’s not my problem …

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:astonished::frowning::confounded::disappointed:

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Exactement!

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“Dropping like flies they are” - Reminds me of that wonderful Agatha Christie novel ‘10 Little Indians’ - Who will be next - Oh! dear, it’s usually the person who asks “who will be next?” - crumbs​:cry::cry::cry:

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If you’re the one on the transporter in a red shirt be very worried

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Today’s XR protestors got a taste of what Joe Public thinks of them - about time too. The police don’t seem to protect ordinary Joe Public any more do they - so Joe Public has to sort it out themselves. Gooid for Joe Public.
Also came across this today - some might find it of interest.

At the last UN climate conference Greta got a lot of MSM attention as she recited her propaganda lessons.

Yet the MSM paid no attention to a letter signed by 500 top scientists stating that ‘there is no climate emergency’.

No Climate Emergency say 500 Scientists to UN

I don’t intend flailing around like a headless chicken crying ‘the sky is falling down’. I have taken, and will take, reasonable steps to do what I can in terms of upcycling ( as someone who prefers to buy second-hand), stop buying fizzy water but keep cold jug in fridge; not buy many new clothes (can’t afford anyway); would like to use use public transport - but how, here in rural France ?
Wasn’t it Mr Micawber who said ‘something will turn up’… I’m certain that huge progress will be made in battery storage; there are even projects in development which would mean every home would have its own mini-generator - there’s an immense world out there of new discoveries, new inventions - and there are many bright young people working on these ideas.
So although I’m doing a little bit, until China and India stop building new coal burning power stations, until Germany stops burning Lignum (check that one out) - I honestly feel that my little half-cent isn’t of much use. As I don’t own a private plane, nor charter one, and don’t fly on foreign holidays then that’s one small step I’ve made to save the planet .
So ‘Stay Calm and make little changes’ is possibly my Mantra.

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I do feel there is a strong scent of Gilead about Extinction Rebellion.

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Here’s a thought… Forget muesli belt middle class pro natural (arsenic is “natural”). How about science driven efficient (ie mon organic) land use? Weed killers (glyphosphates with no proven harm except by extreme rat overdose) GMO (again no proven harm) etc. Forget " natural is best" and oher woo let’s use decades of evidence based research (not to save the planet, it’ll do fine without us, but to save humanity - all of us not just those with enough income to choose). Let the anti vaccination tribe evolve themselves out of the food chain (preferably without taking the vulnerable with them). And don’t get me started on homeopathy…

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Trump bashing is trending, but the environmental problems were evident long before he ever entered politics. Al Gore’s 7 huge mansions’ carbon footprint expose his eco hysteria as so much disingenuous blather - and Obama’s recent purchase of an ocean front property make a mockery of dreaded sea level rise fear mongering. The very rich are different than you and I. Seemingly immune to the ecological consequences of industrialized humanity.

Profanity warning -