Declaring a sold ISA

Obviously I know there’s double tax agreements, but I didn’t know I should fill in any forms.
Obviously my ISA is tax free in the UK so no tax paid there for that. I have had a bit of interest from a Lloyds International Sterling account. I have also paid tax in Germany, I rent out a studio there and have always declared my profits for that in 8TK.

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A quick search here (!!) gives the post by DrMarkH Connexion New French Tax Guide and the link therein gives a publication date this year of 4 April with an 8 April update.

Thanks Elsie, I think I’ll buy that, but it’s not sure it’ll answer my immediate questions.

So Graham is thinking it’s probably in 2TR, Elsie thinks it’s probably in 3VG, another advise I had recommended 2TS and tick 2OP.
Yes, it isn’t easy…
But I really appreciate your help.

2TR is for interest not capital gains
Intérêts et autres produits de placement à revenu fixe (ligne 2TR)

2TS is for other income not capital gains
Autres revenus distribués et assimilés (ligne 2TS)

2OP allows you to claim the tax table rate rather than the fixed 30% rate for interest, dividends, etc. revenue Case 2OP : qui est concerné ? Où la trouver ?

ah… that’s for The Connexion guide - I was looking for a possible date for the brochure practique 2023. Interesting that this publication has an ISBN but unfortunately since the introduction of the 13 digit ISBN, the date code has only ever been “978” or “979” understanding ISBN so I’ll just mark it forward to April next year.

It s published after the taxes for the year have been approved by Senate/National Assembly which has meant, in the past, some delays.

If you want to know when it becomes available in the future, you could scan Documentation | or just set up an appropriate Google alert.

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I’m not too sure a link to the official brochure will be of much help as I don’t think there are many on English forums who would read it.
I get the feeling, based on experience of other forums, not very many even read the explanatory notes which are are available with the individual tax forms (or even the text which goes with the numbered lines on the tax forms!)

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If you look at my guide, you will see that I usually translate the reference into English and paste it alongside the graphic showing where the entry should be made as opposed to separate notes which, as you say, tend to be ignored or overlooked.
For that reason, I would be very interested in your take on the issue faced by @PBS since I would like to add this aspect to my guide for next year. If you have any images of the places where you suggest the details should be posted - even better!
Personally, I haven’t explored those areas of the online return since I had no need to.

references - whether read or not - are useful in adding to the veracity of the information provided giving additional confidence that it is not just urban myth or off the cuff opinion, as it were. So I see them as important but it is for the reader to decide its usefulness or not to them.

OK Graham and Elsie, you both seem competant and helpful and I thank you very much for that.
I have been through all your links etc. I think I’ve read everything that you’ve advised me to look at, but I’m still unsure where to put my sold stocks ISA. It is indeed a one-off capital gain, so perhaps Elsie is right suggesting 3VG (seems logical), but as Graham says, it’s a type of policy that isn’t well understood by the French, so perhaps he’s right, it’s simpler to just put it in 2TR with 17.7%.
I have also been suggested by someone else to put it in 2TS.
I would ask the tax office, but I don’t even know how to describe the policy that I sold in a way that would make sense to them. Is it ok to just say “I sold shares”, I don’t know…

As you’ve already declared the ISA on the 3916, perhaps simply cross reference it (by the number of the account) in your question to them.
I guess they know what UK ISA’s are and will have a response as I doubt you will be the only one…
Perhaps something on the lines (in French) of:

JJ’ai vendu l’ISA déclaré au numéro de compte #n cerfa 3916 mais j’aimerais savoir où déclarer le produit reçu.

might suffice.

I found this:

a useful reference but can you be certain it reflects what you need to do with UK ISAs?
I think the jury is still out… I don’t see a specific mention of a sold UK ISA for example (unless I missed i)t.

You miss the point by thinking of ISA being special in France - they’re just unit trusts / share accounts so far as France is concerned so no differant.
It’s simply capital gain the same as any brokers account/unit trust - same rules as holding stocks/unit trusts etc with Boursarama (outside AVs obviously). Flog an ISA - flog tesla shares - flog Renault shares same thing

A cash ISA is interest only - that’s just a savings account in France.

Yes, that’s right. But there are still different types of policy that are treated in different ways - that’s how I see it.
So you’re suggesting that I’m probably obliged to pass via 3VG and annexe 2074?
2TS or 2TR are simpler.
Is there a possibility to declare the gain only from the date I became a French resident ?
Any abattements possible ?

Declaring gains only from date of French residence might backfire though? As you’d lose at least one level of the discount for having held them a long time. At least by the looks of the above.

Run the numbers, to see?

See my post of May 12

Thanks Elsie.

“Le montant de l’abattement de droit commun doit être déclaré ligne 3SG et le montant de la plus-value avant abattement ligne 3VG de la 2042 C.”

So if for example I had a plus value of 100, I put 100 in 3VG and 85 in 3SG.

  • 2OP.
    And give 2074 a miss.
    Have I understood?
    Do I need to mention that it’s an overseas revenue?

I bought the stocks ISA in 1999 as a one off buy and didn’t touch it until I sold it last year.
I became a French tax resident in 2011, can I work out a gain from 2011 value up to sale value?

The necessary entries are explained in Cadre 3 (page 4) of the 2047 notes
You need to complete section 3 of 2047 which gives the origin and 2042