Never at home

General Discussion
41

Yes, life is a bit like a broken cup. Glue it back together but it will only last so long and will probably leak at some stage. Silly metaphor but it works. Now what was that poem by Larkin? Ah, yes:

They f**k you up, your mum and dad.   
They may not mean to, but they do. 
They fill you with the faults they had   
And add some extra, just for you.
 
But they were f**ked up in their turn   
By fools in old-style hats and coats, 
Who half the time were soppy-stern   
And half at one another's throats.  

Man hands on misery to man.   
It deepens like a coastal shelf. 
Get out as early as you can,   
And don't have any kids yourself.

Too late on the latter, but he got that one right.
42

Like that Jane, wish my mum was a little more like yours, and the third option is often the best. If something's broke, it's broke, you can try and fix it but some times things just can't be repaired so you throw it away and get a new one!

43

Hi Emily

A lot has been said since I first replied to this thread, a lot of advice has been given and you've come forward with a much darker picture than first given. Unfortunately I haven't had the time to keep up with everything that's been said and I've only got a minute or two to write this before dashing off again but I feel I really must say a few things:

Firstly, and as is pretty much always the case, I'm 100% behind Brian and what he says given the additional info you've given about the situation - a situation that is a long long way off just cultural differences and we're now in the realms of abuse and you feeling really shitty as a result - THE SITUATION IS NOT YOUR FAULT, HE IS THE PROBLEM NOT YOU!

Secondly to go back to the whole cultural thing, this isn't that at all, I'm the one in my household who would like things better organised, cleaner, more pragmatic and logical (just me after too much military type training and always seeking efficiency in business/production/life in general) The French can be very laid back in deed and ready to try new things, there are some open minded people out there, even in St Brieuc, I met some 10 years ago, and on that subject there's a mixed nationality couple in St Brieuc - he's an architect and English, she's an english teacher and french - wonderful open people and if you want I'll go through old docs, contacts etc and try and find their contact details. All of this to say yes France isn't the UK, yes it's different but the situation you're in seems far more down to your husband than France. I'm sure that if he was supportive and "normal" then you'd feel so much better and positive and the rest would fall in to place.

As for listening to family - "you chose your friends but get lumbered with family" - they often advise you for what's best and easiest for them, they don't want to have to explain to their friends that their daughter has left her surgeon husband..." I've been there and seen it, my mother took years coming to terms with the fact that I was no longer an officer in the royal navy but had gone back to being a blacksmith!!! all the "advice" she had tried to gove me was for her own self esteem, not mine and it's the same with relationships - I'm divorced too and she was dead against that. Most parents end up barking mad as far as advice is concerned, particularly those who have been sheltered from reality for years/not worked and still think England has an empire...!

That's my take on it, please think seriously about what Brian and many other (life's not a rehersal etc) have said. My label "integrated outsider" doesn't bother me at all, in fact it's fun and makes me rather special, in a group of 100 cyclist no one knows everyone else but everyone knows my name and who I am - it can make you feel like a star rather than an outsider.

Really must go now

Courage, gros bisous et à +

44

I was born in 46 and when my mother found out that my sister"s husband was beating her up went round to their house with a cricket bat and forced her to get out quick!!She always told us as kids that" You accept,change or walk away"

45

Taking children is illegal sure, but one of the reasons a lot of child abuse occurs is because one parent goes and then the abuse that was done to the one who is gone is transferred to them. So, for safety's sakes they should be taken.

You are describing another facet of abuse in which the abused believes she or he is actually the abuser or cause of abuse, like your crying example. The abuser will always allocate blame to the victim. There are so many studies, you can access them easily online. If you do look at them then you'll either be as confused as hell or packing your toothbrush pronto. But they are there. I shall not refer any of them to you because that is placing incentive in your hands, but if you want to know more you were trained to know how to find out things about human beings and just use that skill.

I am not trying to bully or push you but I think you need to act for yourself and ultimately for your children. At first I was far more sanguine, but the more you say, the more you are describing an abuse setting and other people are seeing that too. Look at it by 'stepping back' and looking at yourself from as outside as you possibly can, get information, get advice then do something rather than continue this way. Another point is, should this thread accidentally come to light then your husband's reaction could be adverse. Please do not do this to yourself, for once put number one first!

46

Another one of 'our' generation who broke out of the stereotypical life thing and with very sound advice...

47

Ah - having been born in 47 I have to butt in and say I do not share the opinions ' of most of that generation' since I am one ! My own mother used to say 'you made your bed, you must lie on it' but that was from the generation that DID 'put up and shut up' as mostly they had little option - but my generation (well, most of us - although clearly not those mothers of my era mentioned here !) are more educated, more knowledgable about the world and not willing to put up with things that are clearly not right. There is a lot of good advice on here from different people - ultimately it is your choice whether you take any action on it or not but clearly you must do something - it will have been cathartic for you to enter the forum to discuss what are personal problems, and hopefully it will help you to know you are not alone and that there is support out there. I lived in Brittany (between Morlaix and Guingamp) before moving to Charente Maritime, and I agree there are lots of young English people who live there who would, if you could access them, I am sure, be able to provide a chance for you to meet and chat - there may even be some who could help you with the search for work. Meanwhile PLEASE do go to a Notaire to find out your legal position - or to the Mairie to find out when the Assistante Sociale is available - if you resolve some of your problems with your husband, you will be better armed to deal with it if necessary. You could also take advice from a divorce lawyer as to your position - although your husband is a French national, there is an ad on another forum from an English law firm offering advice for divorce in France. Whilst we are still in Europe (at the moment !) you could talk to him initially to see which side of the channel you could obtain a divorce on that would better suit your position - if that is ultimately what you chose to do .......or, if the situation becomes intolerable, you could expose the behaviour of your husband (with evidence, of course) to his colleagues .........but that is known as revenge and it may not be your forte. Me, I took the house and everything in it - I even took half of the insurance policies !!! (I was working for a divorce lawyer at the time !) I was told I was not entitled to all of it, but my reply ? I may not be entitled, but I am having it ........and I got testimonials from his employer (he was an Underwriter at Lloyds) and colleagues as to his irresponsible behaviour - including evidence from my doctor to whom I went to register the bruising and the broken ribs .....it will be hard, but nothing was won from giving up or giving in ....there are two certainties in life ...death and taxes - and in between life is too short to spend it on regrets - you are young, and have your life before you as well as the responsibility of happiness for your children. above all, DONT LET THE B.....r get you down !!!

48

I have no idea of your situation Emily, nor would wish to take sides -- always 3 sides to every story, but being unhappy is, in my view, one of the most destructive things that can happen to an individual. As you have said the rich-mans lifestyle means jack shit if you are not happy.

I think its time to make the list, the good, the bad and the ugly, decide what you like, what you don't and what you cant stand. Then think if you could change anything of the last 2 that would make your life correct as you would like it to be again.

Its not possible for everything to be perfect, life isnt like that, but it has to have more positives than negatives by a big percentage.

If you cant find a way to change enough of what what you don't like maybe its time to take the courage to leave.

Good luck with it all x

49

But if you don't have your husband's support what have you got? It sounds awful. If money is no problem, could you get an au pair so you can look for work/start your own business. With babies of that age and an 11 yr old you really have not got time to look for work, even though it seems finding a job would make a big difference to your well being.

With regards to your marriage contract, it's not unusual to have one here, especially if you have been married before or children are involved but there are different kinds you know, so what you brought to the marriage should still be yours, not his.

50

Yes ma'am, three years older than me so same generation - we're the ones who thought we changed the world and then did not change ourselves with it. I saw that and got out, probably makes me a classificatory permanent 23 year old except the body didn't play that part of the game! Message: we can all change but too many do not, so somebody must always take that first step alone.

51

If I had ever asked my family for an opinion I would have got roughly the same. When my first wife left me for somebody else it was my fault, when my second and I mutually separated because we had become co-authors, co-workers and lots of things (we still are - and she comes to stay here and my children adore her) my family said I should have stuck it out as a duty. We were mostly not even on the same continent in those days with work, but pragmatism goes against the grain. Then my father was the only one around for number three which was a disaster because I did a floppy-sloppy head over heels with a raving looney (sorry should not say that about her condition, but true), who had a severe but severe alcohol problem and found it hard to stay in bed with one person... Short that one. I was accused of not being able to go the distance and that was that. Then when my father met my present (last and eternal OH) he turned up (at his house, mind you) over two hours late, drunk and aggressive and asked how long she would stick around with his waste of space son. So, yes, rely on families if you wish to get messed up... You have your own very good mind and the courage to go open and do this, which is not without risk of many kinds, and you have bravely and clearly described abuse. Does your mother not understand this world yet, I imagine she is maybe even a little younger than me or at most about the same. Blinkers, that's what they wear. Use your eyes and look clearly at your own life and remember we social scientists always know everything which is why we probably make more mistakes than everybody else!

52

It seems that up until recently you have had a brilliantly successful life, great career, independent, great marriage, 2 healthy kids in quick succession. Do you know what, sometimes it can go wrong, you made a poor choice for one reason or another but it's not your fault. These things happen and you can't change them although you can change what is happening now and in the future.

Your mum is saying you should be grateful but grateful for what? Your husband, unfortunately doesn't sound a very nice person and what if he starts being nicer to you and nastier to your kids instead.

It's impossible to find a job when you have such small children, finding a job or starting up a business is a job in itself, as is looking after babies. I was 39 before I had my kids and I've never had such a difficult job in my life - many tears were shed I can tell you and I've got a lovely husband.

Do yourself a favour, find out what your rights are and then start negotiations with your husband to improve things at home. Childcare is available if you are registered unemployed, so register, get the kids in childcare and apply yourself. You come across so well on here, very capable, so you can be your old self again one way or another, with or without the man you are married to.

It must be terrible feeling the way you do at the moment but you can and will change things, you've done well in the past and you will do well in the future. You are also been very brave telling all on a forum and it is the first step back up. Good luck, you've got a lot of people thinking of you.

PS How old are your children?

54

My mother most definitely would have said that 20 years ago - the Irish "make do/make the best of what you've got" side would've come out with a vengeance. Now she's in her 70s and would say "Oh jaysus, why're you putting up with that? Tell him to sling his hook". Not sure what changed over the 20 years - probably all our perspectives change with time and life experience.

55

I agree with those who say you need to get legal advice. Do not leave stones unturned.

56

Absolutely, Catharine. Just a bit worried because this is a sensitive subject and if you put 'Emily Montes France' in the search engine (I thought I might just be paranoid but tried it), this discussion thread will show up.

Emily, please just be careful.

57

V good point Valerie - if in doubt PM's are the way to go! x

58

You know I was just going to suggest that! lol!

59

Hi Emily,

Just a thought. If your husband or friends who would tell him become aware that you vent online, please just be careful. I'm obviously not suggesting for a minute that there would be a problem with anyone on here and I'm happy you have a place you feel secure and with friends, but you also mentioned that you'd posted on Yahoo. Fuel could definitely be added to the fire.

60

yes I'm still married and have been for 39 years and would have been better off as one of his friends than his wife as you wouldn"t beleive the way he talks to me !!! no respect at all but now I don' t bother any more We have.Nothing really to talk about as we don't have anything in common .I go to the cinema and theatre with my many friends.We go on holiday and go our various ways.What can I say....we do have 5 grand children and see them every sunday and he is a fantastic grandfather .I"m nearly 66 now and if I left now where would I go? No family in england now all my friends are french I have a lovely house he doesn't drink or hit me so I will settle for what Ive got !! Emily I don't think your problem is because he is french you just made a bad choice but men in general do not mellow in old age...sorry you guysI hope I won't shock you Emily by saying when in France do as the french do and go and get yourself a lover!! It helps self estime. I know what I'm talking about. But you are living in a small town and thats not easy to be discreet!! I live in Paris and it was easier