Queen under medical supervision

Like people who talk cliches all the time you mean? :joy:

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It was a nasty comment in your usual poor taste and your not worth the effort to be honest with you.

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As someone who is neither for or against a monarchy, and I stand to be corrected, I’d say that most people of the UK will be profoundly saddened by the death of Queen Elizabeth. We were all born into something which became part of most of our lives – a monarchy.

Her death is akin I think to a life changing event but in a mundane sort of way for ordinary people like myself – ‘God Save the Queen’ will be gone, money and postage stamps will change. And a disorientation will persist for a long time.

I’m not getting into politics, but she was born into a monarchy as well, and was just as much a prisoner of the history, culture & customs of the UK as we were. I’ve said in another post that when you look around at what is going on in the world, I say we are lucky to be where we are.

On a lighter but not unkind note, we all know she loved corgis, but now that Prince Charles is going to be known as King Charles, I can’t get spaniels out of my mind.

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I find myself being bizarrely affected by the Queen’s death. I despise the concept of a monarchy with a passion because I honestly believe in meritocracy, yet I feel a twinge of sadness and almost a sense of loss for some reason.

Even if, as I said, I disagree with the concept, I can recognise that she performed her “duty” admirably. I can’t think of any other members of any other Royal families that are so admired - even adored - throughout the rest of the world.

Regardless of one’s opinions on the monarchy, it is undoubtedly the end of an era.

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I always watch DemainNous Appartiens every night and last night it was cut and I knew what was coming when I saw the dates of birth and death down in the corner of the screen. The coverage which went on all evening was in total respect from a french view and the impression that the Queen was loved and respected here came across very strongly. Had to admit I did shed a tear at the beginning but any death will do that and it was a shock too because we had no idea she was failing but I did notice how thin she had become lately, my mother has gone the same way at 93. RIP Your Majesty.

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I found this tribute very moving. Bravo, M. Macron.

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@Gareth yes it speaks volumes doesn’t it - brings Truss’ “the jury is out” comment about E.Macron into broader focus


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I would say that she was a great example of how one can bring considerable good from challenging circumstances, overcoming temptations and the weight of history. Her death will bring a little more instability to a nation in some turmoil.

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Personally, I wouldn’t use such words – like despise – but I do think of the ordinary folk over centuries who were so poor, when royalty was so outrageously rich and powerful. But, as the Americans say, ‘that’s the way the cookie crumbled’ .

I have a dispassionate view which sees that times do change for the better, and will continue to change, but so very slowly.

Those with activism in their blood, which I don’t have, are those who bring about those changes. And so long as those changes are recognised by the majority as being wanted, then go for it!

This is what knocked me back. I saw the photos of cars arriving with members of the family [“uh-oh - if they’re all here it must be serious”] and then, within minutes it seemed, the announcement that she had died.

The photo of her meeting Truss seemed to show her in a cheerful mood, certainly not someone within hours of death.

It’s the suddeness that has struck me. I have a very dear friend, 91 years old in December [d.v.]. He’s not in good health. He could have one of his bad days, turn south and be gone in an hour or so. When he goes there will be a huge hole in my life and the chances are, as with The Queen yesterday, there will be no warning, no period to prepare.

It’s not quite the same as death by an accident or heart attack because one knows full well it must come - one is ‘waiting for the shoe to drop’ - but the suddeness of the event on the day has been the shocker.

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Yes, agree, sudden was the shock and we all knew it would be on the cards at some time, just not right now. It’s awful

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When you love there is no time to prepare for the finale.

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A very dignified and gracious tribute.

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French style


Look at her hand in that photo! I think she rose from her medical bed just for that meeting, and probably went straight back afterwards and had the cannulas hooked back up.

My guess is that she has been suffering cardiac failure for a while, and it finally got to a point that she couldn’t be kept going.

You can be close to death and still be cheerful.

Given her well documented religious leaning, that is a very likely scenario


Challenging times ahead. Once the shock and mourning fades then there will be undoubtedly a questioning of whether a hereditary monachy is right for the “modern post Brexit Britain” that politicians promise. In an era of social media dominance, meritocracy and equalty is such a regime appropriate? The debate will be should the monarchy, H of L , Peers, Baroness, Knights, honours system et al be consigned to history with the R family following that of other European monarchies. But not autonatically moving to the PM becoming “Presidential” (which is inexorably happening now in UK viz the recent leadership race) and able to be elected by 150,000 white mainly elderly voters from the south of England.
Celebrating the great service of QE2 should not preclude a healthy debate about replacing, in the future, a hereditary and undemocratic head of state.

Given that Truss was once vehmently anti-monarchy she might return to that thread, but for the wrong reasons. At present it is as likely she just wants to quash any possible line of scrutiny, not that she is in favour of political reform.

That process would have to follow the discussion and decision on what it was that the head of state’s role should be. Presidential as in FR or USA or as in Italy, in that instance an unfortunate individual repeatedly calling on a succession of incompetents or banditos to lead a government?

It’s a massive problem. The Establishment of the C o E would have to be revoked, to remove the bishops from the Upper House. A large cull of the hereditary backwoodsmen has been replaced by dishing out peerages to a bizzare selection of people - Lord Lloyd-Webber, anyone? - and the habit of ‘booting upstairs’ superannuated M.P.s.

One of the reasons that the institution of the monarchy has been low on the list of debate about UK politics and its functioning is that it has not been perceived as detrimental to the functioning of government and the political machine. It ain’t broke. It don’t need fixing. Credit for this must go to the late Queen. If King Charles cannot continue in that vein, if he sticks his oar in, the debate will become an issue.

Unfortunately it is broke and does need fixing.

Though I agree that it works well for the present incumbents (and, indeed, Labour when they are in power) so they have little incentive for reform.