I’m one of those arguing here - from my strongly remain personal perspective - that although the referendum was a terrible mistake, hving made it, UK politicians shouldn’t simply ignore the result.
However, there are a lot of problems with your own line of argument here, for example the assumption that ‘honouring the result of the referendum’ has any one single meaning. Isn’t it obvious that the multiple possible ways of ‘leaving’ has been one of the problems all along? The Conservatives and Labour put forward very different interpretations of ‘leave’ at the last election, as did the other parties, and none of them proposed no deal - so it is fundamentally dishonest for the current right-wing extremists in government to claim any mandate from either referendum or election for their policies.
Everyone can rage at where we are now but parliament had several chances to stop ‘no-deal’ by simply voting for TM’s deal, it chose not to. The maddening thing is that if her deal was put to a vote again you can bet that it would get through. What people have also lost sight of is that the passing the WA is just the start of the process, years of negotiating will follow with the ‘backstop’ a key part of that.
Anyway, that’s all too late and the next week will give us an idea of the likely outcome of this madness.
@anon88169868 with his unerring eye for a rank hypocrisy draws attention to Farage shooting himself in the foot here, and I wonder how many highly-paid journalists noticed…
“Farage himself said if it was 52:48 the other way it would be “unfinished business” - in this case what is good enough for Nigel is good enough for me.”
Bravo, Paul.
But isn’t he just a Cad, a lovable rogue, a fluffy Teddy bear? (or have you not bought in to the utter garbage?)
The man conspired to have a reporter beaten up - this is enough for me to not trust this buffoon, I still cannot believe he got to be PM as he is an utter untrustworthy shite.
He has also moved his girlfriend into no 10. I know this is his official accomodation but was it really necessary to install his poke into an offical government residence. He evidently either doesn’t realise the offence he has given or doesn’t care. Since he’s not a total idiot I can only assume the latter. Or maybe I’m just being very old-fashioned in finding this objectionable.
Regarding my earlier comments about the North of England. I apologise to those who took offence - but for better or worse, the concept of “thick northerners” is not my devising. I am equally aware that ignorance is not the prerogative of any one area of the UK - 30% of Scots voted to leave - something of which I am rather ashamed. But if you look at any map showing the voting results of the 2016 referendum, it is somewhat noticeable where the bulk of the leavers are to be found.
And do you seriously think that Bercow’s successor won’t be biased ? - the other way, of course.
i have a couple of problems with the notion that the 2017 GE strengthened the mandate for Brexit over the 2016 referendum.
Both main parties stood on a platform of leaving the EU - albeit with a different, but equally unworkable, view from each party. Thus the 2017 GE did not re-test the public view on Brexit. To say that 80% supported Brexit in the GE (as has been claimed) is disingenuous - it’s a bit like a totalitarian state claiming to be a democracy because it holds elections - but where each candidate simply represents a microscopically different face of, and is endorsed by, the single ruling body or party.
Secondly - insofar as the Tories or Labour described their approach to Brexit neither won a mandate because neither won a majority.
So, to state that there is a mandate for Brexit from 2017 is questionable in itself - to try to state there is a mandate for no-deal is laughable.
Johnson’s, or more likely Cummings’ plan looks simple enough - he’s playing a game of chicken with the EU, he’s made it clear with prorogation that he has locked the steering and thrown the wheel out of the car.
I think he is after one of two outcomes - either the EU blinks (unlikely) or it doesn’t and we go out with no-deal. I suspect that they want the latter but have to be seen to be going through the motions for the former for the domestic audience, they probably think that they can work with either scenario though.
The plan then is to call a GE and stand on a platform “we delivered Brexit (and made the EU blink)”. Having achieved Brexit the Brexit Party is rendered impotent - especially in a no-deal scenario (because Farage cannot then claim the deal betrays the referendum), the Lib Dems have the very essence of their groundswell cut off and even Labour will be wrong footed. The strategy could very well work to get another 5 year term.
The fact that this is purely about Johnson and the Tories being in power and the reach of Cummings personal influence and that the country can go and screw itself other than enabling the PM’s ambitions is what really disgusts me about the current administration.
True in a maddening combination of party politics and the ERG pushing for “pure” Brexit.
I doubt it, we have now got to the point that the hardline Brexiteers will block anything which even sniffs of a deal (and Labour will probably continue to oppose “Tory Brexit” in favour of their own unicorns).
Indeed - they also seem blind to the fact that “no deal” will mean we are very quickly back at the negotiating table, but this time even more disadvantaged compared with the EU position.
And I very much doubt Trump will be along on a white charger to save our collective bacon - he’ll just send a few vultures to pick over the corpse.
And South Wales.
I don’t like liars, and I don’t like men who treat women with contempt. Is that enough for you.
seemingly not 
Jane Williamson and Catharine Higginson: no relevance to the original topic which was: “Opinion: John Bercow is itching to stop Brexit – and he might just succeed.” OK?
That is just how dinner party conversation meanders around a topic, isn’t it. Who made you the thread police?
Why the aggression, especially from a member of the “Team”? Since when has Survive France been considered similar to a dinner party? I must have misunderstood Survive France’s purpose. I’ve noticed the general tone of many comments recently becoming less and less helpful and more and more “in your face”. Maybe that’s the Team’s intention; to add some spice into the forum. Or maybe it’s due to increasing paranoia about what happens after Brexit. Or maybe it’s the weather.
The dinner party thing goes back long before you joined Lee.
Or maybe it’s a reaction to what you have written.
1.No aggression intended, but perhaps you find it hard to judge the tone of a comment, after all yours came over as snippy and patronising.
2.I fear you must never have read the site netiquette.
“Snippy and patronising” and, by implication, against “the site netiquette” to refer fellow commenters back to the original post? Compared with so many comments I’ve read on this forum recently, my offence seems extraordinary mild; but, of course, I’m biased. So it’s back to the dinner party table, I guess…
OK. Perhaps I’m in the wrong place in that case.
Prior to what I’ve written today, I haven’t written much on this forum so my previous comment stands: “I’ve noticed the general tone of many comments recently becoming less and less helpful and more and more “in your face”. Maybe that’s the Team’s intention; to add some spice into the forum. Or maybe it’s due to increasing paranoia about what happens after Brexit. Or maybe it’s the weather”.
It all depends on what sort of dinner parties you have experienced Lee - Most, not all, that we have attended or hosted can, and often do become noisy, humorous and great fun. Adult humour and language are quite normal as are differences of opinion particularly when a mixture of nationalities get together and the wine begins to flow.
The object, l believe of the dinner party rule on SF, is to prevent discussion sinking to personal attack and rudeness - which is something l have been guilty of over the years - but always with some excusable (self) justification.
As for becoming a member of the “thread police” - I’m afraid it’s a question of being asked ( A bit like the Freemasons)